Turn Podcast Guests Into Clients with Smart PR! with Laura Perkes

Episode Summary

You can find Laura Perkes at:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/prwithperkes/
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/laura-perkes/

Laura Perkes Podcast Interview

[00:00:00] Kris Ward: Hey everyone. Welcome to another episode of Win The Hour, Win The Day I am your host, Kris Ward. And today in the house we have Laura Perkes and she is a PR specialist. So we’re gonna learn all kinds of interesting things, and we’re gonna start with the fact that I think PR is often misunderstood.

I know we’ve talked about this before, but I think we have to start there. Laura, first of all, welcome to the show. 

[00:00:21] Laura Perkes: Thank you so much for having me. I’m looking forward to seeing what comes out in this conversation. 

[00:00:25] Kris Ward: We have fun around here. We like lots of content and lots of takeaways, so let’s just in case somebody hasn’t heard our other shows on this or they just got distracted, I know for so many of us, we tend to think that PR is something that.

Or at least I did. When you get bigger, you need PR and then, where does that start? And it’s like you don’t understand that PR is how you make that progress. And also what is PR. I’ve also been discouraged about the concept of PR lately too because AI now live in a remote area, so I don’t have access to the local TV channels that I used to do when I was in a more metro [00:01:00] situation.

But then also who’s watching those TV shows? No one, we’re all streamlining, right? So I think the whole thing of PR to me now also gets a little lost in the shuffle of are we reading magazines? Are we watching tv? Where am I supposed to do this PR stuff? Like it just seems like it, it’s now a little bit more historical than it actually is.

So where do we start? 

[00:01:22] Laura Perkes: It’s a really great point, and one thing I like to remind people is yes. 10, 15 years ago before the social media boom. 

[00:01:31] Kris Ward: Yeah. 

[00:01:32] Laura Perkes: Public relations was very elitist. You had to be a really established brand to be able to afford to bring in like a big show agency to introduce you to their press contacts and get you on TV and radio and in the press.

We know that as technology has advanced, there is now social media, there is now podcasts like Hallelujah to podcasts. Yeah. For creating another platform for us to share our message. And [00:02:00] then you do have platforms like YouTube and TikTok that aren’t necessarily social media. They’re edutainment channels.

[00:02:06] Kris Ward: Right. 

[00:02:07] Laura Perkes: And for me it’s almost let’s look at it all as a holistic thing to do. Okay. Like where do you need to be seen? Buy your audience to hear your message, hear how you work, get to know, trust you and buy from you. And that could be prioritizing podcasts, it could be going onto YouTube channels or collaborating with an influencer who’s already got a really big audience.

[00:02:30] Kris Ward: Okay. 

[00:02:31] Laura Perkes: So it’s less about the traditional media publications like tv, radio, and print. And actually looking at it. Take yourself out of it a little bit and think actually, where are the clients that I wanna reach? Because the print industry is dying. It’s a struggle for them. A lot of them have now created digital websites. 

[00:02:53] Kris Ward: Print has the online version. So how is it print? Yeah, 

[00:02:55] Laura Perkes: yeah. Yes, for sure. And a lot of them now have got content that’s [00:03:00] free. They’ve got content that’s behind a paywall. They’ve got content just for their subscribers. Yeah, even their substack now, Substack seems to be really gaining traction.

And it’s just another platform for you to show up, build a community, and share your message in front of that ideal client. So for me, it’s start with ideal client first, work backwards. Where are they? Where do you need to be? 

[00:03:21] Kris Ward: Okay. So right off the bat. Then PR really can be anything that gets us out there.

So we tend to step over social media and say, all right, I don’t need PR ’cause I’m busy doing LinkedIn. Yeah. So they’re not separate number one. 

[00:03:34] Laura Perkes: Yeah. 

[00:03:35] Kris Ward: Okay. And then the other thing I say is, all right, so you say, where are my people in my case and I’m not the only one. I’m sure that’s like this.

Sometimes you have what we would call, I don’t know, maybe this is silly, but almost like invisible clients. So a lot of the people that I work with, they look really good on paper. If they’ve been in PO business five, 10 years, maybe they have a podcast, maybe they’ve got accolades, they look good and they get a lot of [00:04:00] stuff done, but they are working way too many hours for where they are at this point in their journey.

So I do deal with entrepreneurs that have been in business a while, however. That’s way too broad. Like I’m not going to now try to get an entrepreneur magazine that’s outta my reach. So then I struggle with, okay where are my people? Because I do need to be talking about how more hard work, longer hours, going faster, which has been your coping mechanism is not the answer.

But I think then we get lost in the broadness of the opportunity. 

[00:04:32] Laura Perkes: Absolutely. And I have to say this to people all the time. It’s really easy to be overwhelmed with how many opportunities there are available.

Yeah. And for anyone who is already battling against time, energy, money commitments, then putting PR into the mix is oh, it’s too much.

[00:04:51] Kris Ward: Yeah. 

[00:04:51] Laura Perkes: So I’m very much like focus on PR first. Let that kind of be the top of your funnel. And you can create content [00:05:00] from your media coverage, from your podcast appearances, from your, let’s just say, Instagram lives that you’re doing. 

[00:05:07] Kris Ward: So let me tap down to my question. I think my question for me is.

When I say where are my people? My people are entrepreneurs who’ve been in business a while and I think where we all get shortsighted, I spend so much time on LinkedIn. I don’t know of any magazines or things anymore ’cause I don’t have the bandwidth myself. I’m just focusing on do my LinkedIn thing and then knowing where my people are.

Sometimes we don’t know where they are ’cause it’s too broad. My category is too broad. My category is, entrepreneurs. Now I do have a lot of. Let’s say marketing coaches. I, for some reason have a lot of lawyers, I, things like that. So I guess that helps. But that’s the question is where do you start?

When you say, know where your people are. Okay, great. But it’s too broad. Yeah, 

[00:05:51] Laura Perkes: yeah. Basic. So what I would do is actually look at your client base for clues. So you just told me that a lot of your clients are lawyers and a lot of them [00:06:00] are in the marketing industry. Yeah. So start with the industry magazines that are written for and read by lawyers.

Okay. Okay. And it seems really niche and it seems really focused and granular, but actually, if that’s what they’re reading, then that’s where you need to be seen. And it could be that you may have to read a couple of back issues if it’s still in print or have a look at their online content. 

[00:06:28] Kris Ward: Yeah. 

[00:06:28] Laura Perkes: And realize, oh, actually.

I really enjoyed that article that they were talking about burnout. I can contribute to that. 

[00:06:35] Kris Ward: Yeah. 

[00:06:36] Laura Perkes: Or could be five productivity tips to help you delegate your work to a remote team. Okay. So in almost like everything that you know and you do and making it relevant to that publication, okay, these are my clients that are in the law space.

What is it they come to me for? ’cause if they need it. Other people are gonna as well, other lawyers will need it. So [00:07:00] focus first on those publications, or even podcasts. Podcasts now, they’re still growing at an exponential rate. 

[00:07:07] Kris Ward: Yeah. 

[00:07:07] Laura Perkes: People are like, oh, podcasts are saturated, and it’s Nope, it doesn’t matter.

[00:07:11] Kris Ward: Yeah, 

[00:07:11] Laura Perkes: you just need to be heard on the right podcasts and like with any kind of media outlet, they have an engaged audience. They already have the trust of their audience. So you being bought in, you instantly get that credibility and trust. 

[00:07:27] Kris Ward: I think we get lost, and I’m not anywhere to where my clients are because I do work very reasonable hours.

I have evenings and weekends off. I’m always in a comp state. As one of my clients said, I, I’m not selling the dream and living the nightmare. That’s not I, everything I talk about, I practice what I preach, right? And I do know there’s been times where I see stuff about virtual things and people are getting it wrong or thinking that just the whole debate of being in, out in-house or virtual, what are the pluses and minuses.

So it’s a bigger conversation that can happen a lot of places. I think [00:08:00] where we get losses, I think Wow. I’m always on LinkedIn. I don’t even know where these magazines are. And then you think, alright, like you made a good point. Okay, let’s do some research. And I guess we naively assume because I’m not reading the magazines or I’m not reading the online publications that nobody is, but clearly if they’re in business, somebody is.

So we all just get stuck on, Hey, you need to be on LinkedIn until they tell us, run over here, the sky’s falling, we’re leaving LinkedIn, we’re going to the next purple in whatever the new platform is. Yeah. So I think. Where our scope is limited and our head is down.

[00:08:32] Laura Perkes: Of course. And the thing is as well, and somebody said this to me at a network meeting years ago, is yes, you may want to work with, let’s just say CEOs or you want to get into the C-suite.

You are not necessarily writing an article or being featured on a podcast for that CEO to read or listen. It could be that there’s a junior member of staff who’s reading the industry trade publication, [00:09:00] who reads your article and thinks, oh, actually we spoke about that at our last meeting. I’m gonna take that to my manager and they can take it to the board meeting, or it could be that the CEO’s wife or daughter happens to hear your podcast, right? I had this a couple of weeks ago. I was on a podcast and then I had a message from a guy on LinkedIn saying, Hey, my wife heard you on this podcast and we think you’d make a great guest. Will you come and be a guest on my podcast?

Oftentimes, it’s not the person you are aiming at who finds you, it’s somebody within their network or within their family who’s listening and thinking, wow, I need to connect ’em together. 

[00:09:41] Kris Ward: I guess that just gave me great insight. I guess what you’re really talking about is a more official path for networking.

So we go, we know we have to network. We know what, how lucrative that can be. And it, we just, and that’s why we’re all on social media, is about networking. And then we say, okay, here’s the line in the sand. I’m going [00:10:00] to LinkedIn. That’s as far as I’m going. And you’re like, okay. And I bet you a lot of us, I think especially in the last few years we’ve been, so it’s just drilled into us about social media.

I, I think we’re, a lot of us are dropping the ball or just very shortsighted on the PR part. 

[00:10:14] Laura Perkes: Yeah, and actually you can use LinkedIn Yeah. As your way into pr because so many media publications now have a brand presence on LinkedIn or their writers, or their TV producers, or their radio journalists are on LinkedIn.

So it is just a case of doing a search. 

[00:10:33] Kris Ward: Okay. 

[00:10:34] Laura Perkes: Or say. I don’t think this publication exists, but let’s just say there’s a publication called Lawyers Today, 

[00:10:40] Kris Ward: right? 

[00:10:41] Laura Perkes: Okay. Type that into the search bar on LinkedIn. Okay. They come up with their company page, but then the journalists that write for them, 

[00:10:47] Kris Ward: okay, 

[00:10:48] Laura Perkes: you can then send a connection request.

If they accept, you can then engage in their content, and it’s just another way of getting in front of them and being part of the conversation. So when it comes [00:11:00] to maybe pitching an idea. You can then reference that in an email. Always email pitch. Okay. Yeah. Never actually pitch in the 

[00:11:07] Kris Ward: dm. 

Okay. Okay. But 

[00:11:08] Laura Perkes: It’s building that relationship and nurturing it before you then get down to business with the pitch and say, Hey, I’ve seen this gap.

This is what I know. Would love to share it with your audience. 

[00:11:18] Kris Ward: Okay, that’s a good point. So I’ve heard people say that before, go on LinkedIn, look who’s writing the articles, connect with them. And then I think that’s where we peter out. ’cause it’s again, like we all do on the dms. It’s oh, now I’ve either become their friend or I’m pitch slapping them.

So when we have some sort of familiarity and then we would ask or research where they’re, where I can send them an email. What would be some of the tips, the do’s and don’ts to pitching them. 

[00:11:42] Laura Perkes: So I would always say, and this is gonna blow your mind, it still blows my mind. 

[00:11:47] Kris Ward: Okay. 

[00:11:47] Laura Perkes: Use their name. 

[00:11:49] Kris Ward: Okay. 

[00:11:49] Laura Perkes: The amount of journalists who people will just email and be like, Hey, and then they feel like they’re being pitch slapped.

They feel like they’re being sent a [00:12:00] blanket press release that 50 other people are receiving at the same time. So if you say, Hey, Kris. 

[00:12:07] Kris Ward: Yeah, 

[00:12:08] Laura Perkes: the journalist is gonna be like, okay they’ve passed the first phase. They’ve actually, okay. Used my name and spelled it correctly. And it’s more a case of get your point across as quickly and succinctly as possible.

Okay? Like we are all busy journalists receive between two and 300 emails per day. And that’s not their job. Their job is to write content, 

[00:12:32] Kris Ward: right? 

[00:12:33] Laura Perkes: Make it as easy for them to say yes to you as possible. So honestly, headline can literally be guest expert or pitching expertise so they can see automatically, right?

This pitch. 

[00:12:47] Kris Ward: Yeah, 

[00:12:47] Laura Perkes: literally bullet points, three things of what you wanna do for them, why it’s relevant to their audience, and then a call to action. Let me know if you want more information. 

[00:12:57] Kris Ward: Oh, okay. That’s good. Because I know with the [00:13:00] “Help A Reporter Out”, which I think they changed the name, it’s website, whatever, and they have things that you can say, okay, these are, these authors are looking for this.

But in that case, they often want you to write it. It’s who’s got the time for that? And also, what am I writing for? It’s like me saying, I’m gonna cook dinner for you. Oh, you want it? Test my cooking. Let me cook dinner for you. I have no idea what you want. Yeah. So that’s a good idea. That doesn’t take time.

You can just say, here’s my bullet points. If you want more, I’ll give you more. That makes sense. Yeah. 

[00:13:25] Laura Perkes: And they’re journalists, they’re creative people, so you are igniting the spark for them, 

[00:13:31] Kris Ward: right? 

[00:13:32] Laura Perkes: For them to, for the creative juices to start flowing and be like, oh, I like this, but actually this is what I wanna focus on.

They’ll come back to you and say, this is a great idea. Are you happy to do X, Y, Z? You then get to say yes or no. 

[00:13:47] Kris Ward: Okay. Okay. 

[00:13:49] Laura Perkes: And it’s just being helpful to them. 

[00:13:52] Kris Ward: And no links. 

[00:13:54] Laura Perkes: No links. 

[00:13:55] Kris Ward: Okay. I can see that from I don’t know if everyone’s aware, we find, hire and onboard [00:14:00] virtual assistants and we put them in our leadership program and we have this whole trial 12 point process and hiring process, and we’ve got 90% retention rate.

It’s all good and shockingly people would be horrified to find out that in the first, there’s all these little micro tests I do, and in the first stages I look at the cover letter and I’m looking for very specific things and I, you’d be surprised how many times somebody say blah, blah. Hi, and then here’s the link to my resume.

I am not clicking that link. I don’t have the time nor the interest to navigate through your resume. I’m looking frankly. For how quickly you can summarize like, you wanna work with me, how can you concisely give me information and I have never clicked the link, or here’s some more samples of this. And I, so that really taught me, you think you’re being helpful when you give somebody a link in an email and I was like, oh, I, it’s not helpful for me when I’m the one having to go through two or 300 applicants really quickly.

So I, I think that’s a point worth making. 

[00:14:53] Laura Perkes: Yeah, absolutely. When you’re pitching in an email, put everything in the body of the email. If they’ve then [00:15:00] decided, yes, I would love for you to be included in this feature. They may say, can you write the article? They may say, can I call you to interview you? They may send you interview questions.

At which point they may say, can you send me a headshot? Okay. You can then either attach it to the email or if you’ve got like a link to an online image library, you can send that to you. They can choose what they want, but yeah, don’t ever send attachments or links in that first instance.

[00:15:28] Kris Ward: Okay. 

[00:15:28] Laura Perkes: It’s exactly like you’ve said much.

[00:15:31] Kris Ward: Yeah. Okay. I really like where we’re going ’cause that’s doable. It just seemed like a lot of work before. But yes. Here’s the three things I can be talking about building virtual teams interest in and also we have experience, we have to have good hooks in our content, in our posts. So here’s a hook.

Do you want this subject right? And then here’s three points. And if they say yes or no, great, fine. How long did that take me? We move on and we either move on to another writer or we move on and say, my hook and my tips and my ideas have to get better or do whatever. Okay, [00:16:00] that’s doable.

Okay, fantastic. Alright. Can we mess it up after that? Do we drop the ball? Where does this peter out? What are we not knowing? 

[00:16:08] Laura Perkes: So one thing to understand when pitching to the press is kind of understanding the cadence in terms of following up, okay. In business, we understand that when we are speaking with clients or potential clients for is in the follow up.

There is some etiquette around how often to follow up with, so I have a rule of thumb of if I haven’t heard back within a week. I will resend that original email with a, “Hey, I appreciate your inbox is really busy, but just wanting to see how this lands with you, or is it ready?” Okay. 

[00:16:43] Kris Ward: Okay. 

[00:16:44] Laura Perkes: If they don’t reply to that, I then tend to leave it.

Okay. I have much of the opinion. We are all adults. If it’s relevant, they’ll come back to you when they need it. You could then do a third follow up if you’ve got something extra to add. If [00:17:00] you’ve just seen new statistics or new research that enhances what you were saying, include it otherwise, or something happened in the news, we really, this now has become a hotter topic. Yeah, of course. Otherwise, don’t just automatically assume that it was a terrible idea. 

[00:17:16] Kris Ward: Yeah. 

[00:17:16] Laura Perkes: Just know that these people are very busy and maybe it’s not for right now. Okay. But some journalists file emails and they’ll come back to it when it’s relevant. I’ve had journalists come back to me 12 months.

Oh, okay. After I send a pitch to say, oh, hey, I’m actually working on something now that this would be brilliant for nine times outta 10, I’m not working with the client anymore. Okay. But of course I’ll follow it through and make any introductions necessary. But then it’s a case of would this idea work for a similar publication with a similar audience covering similar topics?

[00:17:48] Kris Ward: Okay. 

[00:17:49] Laura Perkes: And this is where using AI can really become a time advantage for you. Don’t trust it a hundred percent. There does still need to be a human element of [00:18:00] research involved. 

[00:18:01] Kris Ward: Yeah. 

[00:18:01] Laura Perkes: But you can absolutely, go to AI and say, this is a pitch that I’ve sent to X publication. Can you suggest other publications it would be relevant for? And it’ll come back to you within seconds. 

[00:18:15] Kris Ward: Yeah. 

[00:18:15] Laura Perkes: So that again, is taking a real hefty chunk of research time off of your plate. Yes. I would still check those. To make sure that they are a hundred percent relevant and then you’ve got a pitch ready. Yeah. You don’t have to change much. Just make sure the journalist name has been changed.

[00:18:34] Kris Ward: Yeah. 

[00:18:34] Laura Perkes: And again, it’s almost repurpose what you’ve already got. Not everything has to be a brand new, fresh idea. 

[00:18:40] Kris Ward: Right. 

[00:18:40] Laura Perkes: You use what you’ve got to its advantage. 

[00:18:44] Kris Ward: Okay, so we do the pitch that’s successful. We get some content out there. Is there ways that we can leverage that more?

Or what, how do we sustain that relationship? Or what, where can we drop the ball again? Just So I think these [00:19:00] things tend to bleed out when they don’t need to. 

[00:19:02] Laura Perkes: Oh, yeah, absolutely. And this is one thing I’ve actually developed in the last year, is my very own kind of PR to profit method.

Okay. Because it’s helping business owners and entrepreneurs leverage what they’ve got. It’s not easy landing a podcast interview. It’s not easy being featured in a publication, but so many of us, and I’ve done this myself, I’ve had a piece of coverage. I share it on social and then it’s forgotten about the next one.

[00:19:26] Kris Ward: Yeah. 

[00:19:27] Laura Perkes: I’m like no. It’s not a trophy. Let’s use it as a growth tool. Use it as an asset. So then it’s almost, if you’ve had sales conversations in the past and the person chose not to work with you, but you’ve mentioned something in that podcast that they mentioned to you, go back to them and go, “Hey.

I know you weren’t ready at the time. I’ve just been on this podcast. I think you’re gonna find this really interesting. Send them the link. Okay.” 

[00:19:52] Kris Ward: Okay. 

[00:19:53] Laura Perkes: Then let them kind of restart that conversation with you. Yes. Share it on social media, but don’t just share [00:20:00] it once. Take quotes out of the article or take clips from the podcast and tie it into a relevant conversation for now. 

[00:20:08] Kris Ward: Okay. So that’s a good point. So I think what you’re saying is, alright, I got on there. Fantastic. It’s not a trophy, don’t just leave it on the shelf. And the whole idea about PR is public relations and a little bit of a humble bragging showing off. So whenever you can really have an inventory of the stuff that you’ve done that you can pull into and repurpose later.

You know what, if you were in that magazine three years ago, that’s fine. Quote it again and show people you were in that magazine, that still happened. So that’s a good point, is keep the repurposing alive. And then as far as if you’ve been in some sort of content, do you leverage that to come back later to that same publication, or do you leverage it to get on other publications as far as keeping the PR purpose alive in the industry?

What are some things we can be looking at? 

[00:20:57] Laura Perkes: So absolutely keep that [00:21:00] relationship with the journalists, the podcast host, the producer, warm. And what I mean by that is, and again, this is where social media’s fantastic because you can make sure you’re following them. Yeah. Just engage in their content when it feels right.

Yeah. Nobody wants, a kiss ass. It’s almost, really enjoyed that article. And something else that’s gonna Yeah. Stand out on the feed. It doesn’t, 

[00:21:24] Kris Ward: don’t just talk to them when you want something. 

[00:21:26] Laura Perkes: No. 

[00:21:27] Kris Ward: And keep it alive. Keep the relationship alive. Yeah. 

[00:21:29] Laura Perkes: Yeah, of course.

And when it’s a podcast, it’s maybe slightly more difficult. You don’t have to DM the host all the time. Yeah. It could be, do you know what? Leave a review or subscribe. 

[00:21:37] Kris Ward: Yeah. Yeah. 

[00:21:38] Laura Perkes: And they’re gonna, they’re gonna know that it, it’s you that’s taking time out of your day to listen to them.

[00:21:45] Kris Ward: Fantastic. Okay. Alright. And so what would be a healthy diet for PR? As far as my focus on that? Is that something I do weekly, monthly? Is it a half hour? Is it a couple hours? Keep a simple spreadsheet [00:22:00] going. 

[00:22:00] Laura Perkes: That’s a good question. And I would start with how much time do you have to invest?

Okay. This is where having a team of VAs who 

[00:22:08] Kris Ward: Yeah. 

[00:22:09] Laura Perkes: Outsource to, and it can be a collaborative effort between all of you. 

[00:22:13] Kris Ward: Yeah. 

[00:22:13] Laura Perkes: Because I know for established entrepreneurs, time is precious. 

[00:22:17] Kris Ward: Yeah. 

[00:22:18] Laura Perkes: And you don’t want to all of a sudden start having to feel like you’re doing more admin tasks. 

[00:22:23] Kris Ward: Yeah. 

[00:22:24] Laura Perkes: But it could be a case of working alongside your VA team to find the opportunities to create the pitch and then keep the business owner or the entrepreneur in the loop so that they’re showing up just to do the 

[00:22:40] Kris Ward: Yeah. 

[00:22:41] Laura Perkes: They need to do, and then it goes back to the VA team to follow up and make sure that has got all the information they need. I would say for consistency, an hour or two a week. 

[00:22:53] Kris Ward: Okay. 

[00:22:54] Laura Perkes: Okay. Because again. Yes, we can go really broad and we can spend, this is my job. This is my career. [00:23:00] Yeah. I spend all day doing this. 

[00:23:01] Kris Ward: Yeah. 

[00:23:02] Laura Perkes: But it doesn’t have to be that way. 

[00:23:04] Kris Ward: Right. 

[00:23:04] Laura Perkes: I would say an hour or two a week. 

[00:23:07] Kris Ward: Okay.

[00:23:07] Laura Perkes: Even if just for the first month is looking at what’s around you, what’s available. And most people are connected to somebody on LinkedIn who’s connected to someone else who has a platform that you can speak on. 

[00:23:20] Kris Ward: Yeah. 

[00:23:20] Laura Perkes: So it’s just paying more attention to what’s around you and utilizing it to your benefit.

[00:23:27] Kris Ward: Okay, Laura? Excellent. Oh my gosh, this is great stuff. Where can people find more of your brilliance? 

[00:23:33] Laura Perkes: They can. The best place for me is on Instagram. Okay. So that’s very much a mixture of personal and business. 

[00:23:41] Kris Ward: Okay. 

[00:23:42] Laura Perkes: So that’s @PRwithPerkes, or I am also on LinkedIn again at Laura Perkes. And I’m not gonna share my website with you ’cause it’s currently going under a massive overhaul.

[00:23:55] Kris Ward: That’s okay. 

[00:23:56] Laura Perkes: If you visit it today, the day we’re recording, it is not a reflection of [00:24:00] the brand now 

[00:24:00] Kris Ward: we’re all a work in progress, but I do love the fact that you were blessed with a good marketing name, PR perkes oh my gosh, I always remember being in grade six and we were in the art class and we had to do something for our name.

And I was sitting beside a girl named Dawn Thistle, and I was like is the, aren’t you gonna get an A? You were blessed. Okay. Share this show with a business buddy. Tons of takeaways here. We don’t want them banging around by themselves. Thank you again so much, Laura. We appreciate you and everyone else.

We will see you in the next episode.