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Recent Podcast Episodes

How To Market Your Business On Pinterest Like A Ninja! with Kate Ahl



Episode Summary

This week’s episode of Win The Hour, Win The Day Podcast is sponsored by Win The Hour, Win The Day’s Signature Coaching Program the Winners Circle. Kris Ward who helps entrepreneurs to stop working so hard interviews, Kate Ahl.


Kate Ahl, a Pinterest marketing expert, shares her top tips on leveraging Pinterest to grow your business. Discover the power of this underutilized platform and how easily you can generate traffic for your business.

How to use it as a cold lead generator
Why it’s a fantastic long game option in your business
Why followers don’t matter on Pinterest
And MUCH more!


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You can find Kate Ahl at:
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Kate Ahl Podcast Transcription

[00:00:00] Kris Ward: Hey everyone. Welcome to another episode of Win The Hour, Win The Day, and I am your host, Kris Ward. And today we have Kate Ahl in the house and she’s gonna talk to us about Pinterest, which I have to say I have completely misunderstood this platform a couple times.

[00:00:14] So stay tuned, really focused on this because I think we’re all missing some opportunities here. Let’s dive into it. Welcome to the show, Kate.

[00:00:24] Kate Ahl: Hey, thanks so much for having me.

[00:00:26] Kris Ward: Okay, Kate. I know for me for the longest time I thought Pinterest was a fantastic place for recipes if you’re getting married and if you wanted to decorate a she shed.

[00:00:38] And other than that, I did not think there was anything else going on there. And apparently I’ve been misinformed.

[00:00:46] Kate Ahl: Yeah, there’s a lot going on there. So much more, so many niches that it serves in ways that people really get a lot of traffic from the platform, which is pretty awesome given that a lot of the other platforms out there just don’t drive as much traffic.

[00:00:59] Kris Ward: No, and I did have somebody else in the show that gave me the awakening, to slap some sense into me. So we’ve been dabbling with it a little bit. And of course, oh my gosh, like I’m I went so narrow minded, I just stumbled into using it when I was looking for healthy recipes. And then of course I’d just come back and look for more.

[00:01:17] And not in a million years did I ever think of keying in what my audience is looking for. And then when I had kristen Werner on the show, and she said that, and we started Googling and Pinterest. I’m like, my heavens, look at this. Look at people that are doing, my competitors are doing equal or less job than I am with all their content there.

[00:01:36] And it was like, it was embarrassing and such an awakening. So people are going, which I still struggle with. So people are going to Pinterest to say, in my case, they’re keying in how to hire an outsourcer. Do we display that content differently than we do in other platforms? Where do we start?

[00:01:55] Kate Ahl: Yeah, so I would say start with where you’re at, that awareness of you did a search and you were like, what is happening?

[00:02:02] I tell everybody, go to Pinterest, search your name, search your topic, search keywords like you would Google, just to see what’s out there so you can frame up and get an understanding of it. And then from there it’s really taking it to the next level, like you just said. Oh my people are searching for it.

[00:02:18] And I think one of the biggest barriers and the leaps to using it for yourself for your business is going from personal to business. A lot of people are like, wait a minute, I just use it for recipes. But you don’t put yourself in the shoes as somebody else who’s using it for a different purpose.

[00:02:33] And so that is number one, just seeing how it works, figure it out. But I think the biggest barrier has also been we take what we know about Instagram, Facebook, or TikTok, and we overlay it onto Pinterest. We’re like I’ll just repurpose cuz repurpose is like the theme of the day, right? Yeah. Everybody wants to be efficient, smarter, faster, better, but Pinterest lives over here with YouTube and Google.

[00:02:54] It’s a totally different thing and a lot of people use it cuz they don’t want the noise, they don’t want the interruption, they don’t want the conversation, they wanna curate their own life and their own world.

[00:03:05] Kris Ward: Ah, okay. Hold on. That makes sense because as you’re talking, I was thinking, I don’t get it. I don’t because the, I don’t get it.

[00:03:13] I don’t get somebody looking for my work there, even though I keyed it in and somebody else was posting there. So I thought it should be there cuz him or her are there. So I might as well be standing there against the wall in case somebody asks us to dance. But I was thinking, what’s the incentive when there’s like there’s so many other platforms they have to step over to get to there in theory, right?

[00:03:35] But what you’re saying is, it is a more clear path. I don’t have to engage some, somebody could be just looking for the answers of “hey, how can I get time back in my work, I’m burning out.”

[00:03:47] So then they don’t have to engage and socialize in all the noise and they just get, and also I do find Pinterest for recipes, like when I key in. Healthy recipe. They know what I mean? Yeah. You do that on Facebook. Sometimes they’ll say, this is a really healthy recipe, and there’s two cups of sugar. Like we’re….

[00:04:02] Kate Ahl: yes.

[00:04:03] Kris Ward: What

[00:04:03] Kate Ahl: yes.

[00:04:04] Kris Ward: are you talking about where is the healthy coming from? I don’t even know they’re making a healthy what? You know what I mean? And but now Pinterest has it down to a dime. They know I only use almond flour. They know I only do this. So it is a powerful search engine, and I just couldn’t see how I could be the recipient of that.

[00:04:20] Kate Ahl: Yeah, exactly. And I think a lot of people too, especially when you talk about burnout, social media leads to a huge amount of burnout. And when people are going through social media detoxes, the one app they don’t get rid of is Pinterest because they don’t see it as social media. So I have friends who are like, I’m done with Facebook, I’m done with Instagram.

[00:04:38] I’m not gonna do TikTok, but I’ll never give up Pinterest. Because I can curate and find things that serve my life. And so a common phrase that I use is Instagram’s like a bar. Pinterest is like a library. You wouldn’t take and walk into a library with all the excitement and the conversation that you would a bar.

[00:04:56] It’s like people would look at you like, “Stop talking like this is not the place for this.” And so when you think about sharing like you do on Google, or even like you do on YouTube where you’re educating people very top of the funnel where they’re just curious, they’re ready to be like inspired the aha moment.

[00:05:15] That’s how you hook in a Pinterest user who doesn’t know anything about you. So it’s like a cold lead source. Whereas Instagram is like a warm lead source.

[00:05:22] Kris Ward: Hold on. Are you also saying that it’s gonna come up in the Google search?

[00:05:26] Kate Ahl: It can, I will say Pinterest and Google have had a little bit of a tenuous relationship over the years.

[00:05:31] We used to see a lot of Pinterest links and boards populate on Google. It still does, but Google’s kind of turned off that faucet a little bit.

[00:05:39] Kris Ward: Okay.

[00:05:40] Kate Ahl: But you wanna use it more the same way you use Google. People are typing in phrases or words into the search bar on Pinterest, right? And they like the images because that hits them first.

[00:05:51] And people on Pinterest don’t read, right? They only look at what’s in the image and they’re like, Ooh, this Connects, click, go to website.

[00:05:58] Kris Ward: Okay, so you got me all hopped up here. All right, so then if I’m doing something, would I be better served than, let’s say we were just doing something the 12 steps to my hiring process, which I do for my clients in the Winners Circle, but there’s very specific steps and people are always amazed at how it’s crafted and how I have such a high 90% retention rate.

[00:06:17] So we made this PDF just even if you are never gonna hire yourself, so you can see oh, this is how she, like the thought that goes into it. Yeah. So in Pinterest, I’d be better served to have a visual PDF loaded up on that than just a blog on it.

[00:06:33] Kate Ahl: Actually vice versa. So you want your visual PDF on your website, but you want a little bit of a blog post on it to talk about it on Pinterest.

[00:06:40] So actually I would ask a question back to you is what’s the pain point of the person before they even need these 12 steps like what are they asking?

[00:06:49] Kris Ward: They are thinking, I need some help in my business. I can’t do it all my own, but can I afford help? So I’m in that position.

[00:06:58] Kate Ahl: So then blog content might be around like, how do you know if you’re ready to hire a team member?

[00:07:02] Kris Ward: Okay.

[00:07:02] Kate Ahl: Can you afford to hire a team member? How much do you pay a team member? All of those things are what people are putting into Pinterest because they’re curious about it, right? They’re not ready for the 12 steps yet. They’re just ready for, are you gonna answer? Are you the expert to help me know if I can afford to hire a team member?

[00:07:20] And then I will come read about that and then, okay, I’ll see your PDF at the end of the blog post and go. She has the, here’s the 12 steps. Okay. I’ll do more research. People on Pinterest are way back at that question phase. Here’s another good example. I worked with a company that sells grief boxes and they started putting onto Pinterest some of the main content.

[00:07:42] People were asking them like, what do I say when I lose a spouse? What do I say when somebody loses a friend? What do I give them? What? So they started answering these main pain point questions that people had when they wanted to serve their friends or their family. Write micro blog posts and then at the end it’s like we have this amazing box that will ship for you to, to this person.

[00:08:01] So now they’ve opened up this totally cold lead source that people aren’t even interested in finding a gift. They’re interested in what do I say? But they see that this company had a solution.

[00:08:13] Kris Ward: Okay. Wow. Alright. Talk amongst yourself people, cuz I’m sorting this out in my head. Okay. Alright. So I think also I misunderstood that other people for sure could be looking for, my audience could be looking for my answer on Pinterest and then also, then it’s not somewhere we just stick up the same stuff that we repurpose on all the other platforms.

[00:08:36] So then we need to bring it down to the most basic of questions of, how can I hire, when am I ready to hire? How much does it cost to hire? Like really basic 101 questions and give those answers. And then they, we can direct them to the website, to bigger blogs, to more information. But we are totally just like when I have somebody quickly coming for dinner, okay, chicken meal, I can barbecue fast, this is what I want. I don’t have time. I don’t want noise. I just want the, here’s my question. I want the, a direct path to my answer. And so it’s really, could be very much more of a Q&A instead of a discussion. Like all of the other stuff we’re doing. Okay.

[00:09:17] Kate Ahl: I often tell people, take your FAQs. You get them all day long. Oh, you can answer them immediately. There’s things I hear all the time from Pinterest or from people trying to do Pinterest marketing. So we take and we repurpose that into blog posts, into podcasts.

[00:09:32] Like, how do I upload video to Pinterest, have a clean up my Pinterest boards, how do I use the shop tag? Like these are the nitty gritties. And then people then come to me and say, okay, you’ve just taught me how to upload this video, but let’s back up a little bit. I don’t have a strategy and I don’t have time.

[00:09:49] Can I just hire you guys to do it? Or can I buy a course of yours for you just to help me figure it out? But we’re answering entry level questions to get them into our ecosystem cuz they’re never searching Simple Pin Media or Kate Ahl. They’re only searching… how to do something. They’ll care about me over there.

[00:10:07] They care about getting an answer to their question. I can warm up to them later, and then they can follow me on Instagram or all those other things. But that’s an afterthought in the process.

[00:10:17] Kris Ward: And it is. There’s so much noise listen, ugh, I know I need to be on social media and there’s listen, and I’m grateful.

[00:10:24] Like back in the day when the dinosaurs roamed the earth and I’d have to get up and go, yes. And go to a business breakfast, and you sit beside somebody that you’re like I got up really early to sit beside you, and you are not interesting to me at all. There’s nothing here. Yeah. And so I am thrilled that there’s LinkedIn in places like that.

[00:10:40] Yeah. But at the same time, it also feels like a monster, a beast I’m constantly having to feed. Yep. And sometimes I really do go in. I’m like, I can’t. I just can’t. My brain goes in too many different directions. It’s because it’s oh, I should be doing this. I’m not doing this. Did I respond to them enough?

[00:10:54] Like it’s just a lot of noise coming at you, but you are right. The more you talk, the more I understand that. I don’t feel that with Pinterest. I go in, I need something. I get it. And I just do a search and it comes up. And again, I thought it was all designed because like when I recently moved into a new house and I’ve got a designer friend and I’m like, I don’t know if that’ll work.

[00:11:15] Key something in. And an image will come up in a second that I’ll go, oh, I see what you’re talking about now. Oh, there’s the answer, right? Whereas you could go on to TikTok, any of them, and all of a sudden you come away later with, I don’t know, a pair of earrings and a new perspective on why you should go rock climbing. And the question was, when do I start outsourcing?

[00:11:35] Kate Ahl: Yes. Totally.

[00:11:36] Kris Ward: Okay. All right. That, oh, this is all kinds of clarity. Okay. So we don’t know what we don’t know. So these are cold leads and we are in this discovery stage. And this must, now that we’re understanding it, this must eat at your soul that the rest of us. Don’t have a clue.

[00:11:52] Kate Ahl: Yes, it does. Believe me, I’m banging my head against the wall, especially because we’ve worked with so many clients and currently do work with a lot of clients where when I look at their analytics and what the data is telling us, it’s Google, Pinterest, but they’re spending hours on Instagram and I’ve fallen into that too.

[00:12:09] Kris Ward: Yeah.

[00:12:10] Kate Ahl: Where our social media, we spend 10 to 12 hours a week on Instagram, and this last January when we really peeled back the curtain, and we’ve known this for years, Pinterest has always been our largest social traffic driver. I said, why am I playing this game? Like we’re gonna start creating, cuz you can do short form content on Pinterest.

[00:12:29] We’re gonna reframe it instead of the dancing lip syncing reels, whatever. Instagram changes its mind every Thursday. And we’re gonna move it over to Pinterest to continue to do what we’ve said, which is answer those basic questions in short form video. Repurpose for YouTube, repurpose for LinkedIn, and then Instagram’s an afterthought.

[00:12:48] And now our hours haven’t gone from, we haven’t taken and gone 10 to 12 hours a week on Instagram and put it on Pinterest. We’ve done three hours a week on Pinterest, if that. That’s a little bit more when you add in content creation and let Instagram fall where it will, and that has been such a relief.

[00:13:06] So I will always tell people when you start to begin to market on Pinterest, it’s going to take 6, 9, 12 months to see it work. It’s like a snowball.

[00:13:15] Kris Ward: Okay.

[00:13:15] Kate Ahl: Once you build it, once you invest in it, something that really hits with an audience will drive traffic for years. Like I have a pin from 2017 that brings me, I don’t know, I added it up the other day.

[00:13:26] I think in the last five years it’s brought me 200,000 sessions of traffic and a thousand email leads, and I touch it maybe once a year for 30 minutes okay. No, go ahead. I, it’s really that I want people to know you’re going to have to invest for a while. It’s not gonna feel good. There’s no dopamine hits.

[00:13:41] Kris Ward: Okay. Which is fine cuz I’m not getting a lot of dopamine hits on the other places either. Exactly. I’m getting the hits upside the head. Upside the head. These dressing me up. Okay, so let’s be clear on the content then for Pinterest.

[00:13:54] Kate Ahl: Yes.

[00:13:54] Kris Ward: So for Pinterest, we want basic questions to direct answers in the discovery phase.

[00:14:01] And how long should the post be? What’s should we repost them within Pinterest on different boards? How important are the visuals? Where do we start with the 101?

[00:14:11] Kate Ahl: Yeah. I’ll walk through the workflow a little bit. So we have three types of pin formats on Pinterest.

[00:14:15] Kris Ward: Okay.

[00:14:16] Kate Ahl: We have what’s commonly referred to a standard pin. This is one that I use for blog posts, for informational posts on my site. I don’t think posts have to be that long. We’re talking five, 700 words. Unless you’re trying to do double duty and also optimize for Seo. Mine tend to be a little bit longer cuz I’m trying to hit both platforms. So I’ll write a longer form blog post, but if you don’t have time for that, go 500, 700 words answer the question, right?

[00:14:44] So our standard pin just leads out to that on your website. They have another format called idea pins. This is like a story in a reel. Had a baby, and you can do video micro content less than a minute. Again, like a reel.

[00:15:00] Kris Ward: Didn’t know that.

[00:15:00] Kate Ahl: Okay, you might take, let’s take my blog posts, how to clean up Pinterest boards. Then I might take and a microcontent of me talking walking through those four steps, people can then go read and get my guide on my website at that same blog post. So I still only have one piece of content, but now I have two pin formats, right? You can also do an ad, but we’re not gonna talk about that.

[00:15:23] But that’s the third way that you’ll see on Pinterest. So really, for most people, it’s a standard pin and an idea pin, and what we are hoping for, because Pinterest, this is how they work, is people look at the image or they look at the content. It peaks their interest and they want to learn more. They come to your website, so ensuring that the landing page or the blog post very clearly written, very clearly directed, and you have a call to action. That’s really how the basic workflow works.

[00:15:54] Kris Ward: So would you say too that the visual is more important here? Like even something like avoiding burnout, it like having a funny visual, more bright, like just to stop the scroll is really matters more here than the other platforms.

[00:16:08] Kate Ahl: 100%. So here’s something to clarify too. When people open up the app, there’s two ways that they interact. One is what they see on the screen right away, and Pinterest refers to this as a smart feed or a home feed. Everybody’s smart feed or home feed looks different. Yours might have a lot of recipes. My mine might have, like she shed stuff or gardening or whatever I’ve been searching right?

[00:16:31] And then there’s a second place called a search feed, and this is when you put in the keywords into the search bar and everybody’s looks the same because Pinterest will categorize the most popular there as well in those both cases people only look at the image. Here’s another quick tip.

[00:16:50] If there’s text on the image, Pinterest will read that and categorize it the same way as they do the Pinterest description that you’ve written out below. People don’t read that Pinterest description. The algorithm does, but they also look at the image. So taking an example of your burnout, we might have a person sitting at the desk like, just add their wits end.

[00:17:11] So right away there’s a connection with whatever’s in the image. And then it might say, are you ready to stop the burnout? And come just yes I am. It’s like billboard advertising. You’ve got a second to catch ’em at their pain point. And then they’re like, yeah, I’m ready to read how to be done with burnout cuz I’m exhausted.

[00:17:32] Now, what’s great about that is we have high intent and low intent, meaning somebody could be searching ways to avoid burnout, and they find it there, or it just comes across their feed and they’re like, Oh, I didn’t even know that people were talking about burnout. I was looking for 15 minute recipes cuz I’m so exhausted. I just need to make it.

[00:17:53] Kris Ward: Okay. That’s really helpful to me because in my head my next question was, please forgive me Kate, cuz you were doing a spectacular job of clarifying everything. But my people who are so stressed out and running their business, I don’t see them dabbling with Pinterest. But if they do need to even search something like, holy crap, I have to make 12 brownies for my kid tomorrow.

[00:18:18] And I was given, it’s 10 o’clock at night and I was given notice and it’s baking school, bake day tomorrow they go on Pinterest, looking for a quick recipe or something. And then they see the burnout thing like so they may stumble across this in pursuit of other things, which makes sense to me cuz I couldn’t see my people. Going, okay, I can’t take it anymore. I’m going Pinterest to solve my burnout problem.

[00:18:37] Kate Ahl: Yeah, exactly. Okay. They’re, you can easily connect with a pinner and pique their interest because they have fringe things in their brain along with their an intentional brownie. But they might see it.

[00:18:53]  It’s important to note too, Pinterest is not a time-based algorithm or even like a follow based algorithm. So you don’t take the things like, I wanna get a million followers. It doesn’t really matter. What you’re looking for is really targeting your end user based on their interests and the things that they’re searching. That’s it.

[00:19:12] Kris Ward: Oh my gosh. Okay. All right. Oh, I, too much information. It’s all cl…

[00:19:19] Kate Ahl: totally get it.

[00:19:20] Kris Ward: I’m short circuiting. Okay. Please listeners jump in and ask questions. All right. Okay, so I’m getting more clarity on that. Now, one of the things is this, people doing it wrong. Sometimes I go, let’s say again, forgive me, I was only using it for recipes.

[00:19:35] Okay. So I key in a recipe and then I get one. And then you scroll. And you scroll and they tell you how this recipe, their brother-in-law didn’t like it because he doesn’t like chocolate. Yeah. And his brother-in-law had a weight pro. And then all of a sudden give me no recipe and scroll, and we get to the bottom.

[00:19:50] But I do find that annoying about Pinterest is I don’t need to know how chocolate was invented and how your mother felt about it. I would like this recipe.

[00:19:59] Kate Ahl: So what’s interesting about that is you’re consuming it on the blog content side. So you’re consuming it on their website. So their Pinterest is just, it’s an image that intrigued you and now you’re at their website.

[00:20:09] Now what they’re doing with these long form blog posts is they’re optimizing for seo. Oh. Because…

[00:20:15] Kris Ward: oh, okay.

[00:20:15] Kate Ahl: Google needs a length of a blog post, so you have to add context so that Pinterest doesn’t think it’s a bot. So it’s a common, I would, I work with a lot of food creators and this is a common frustration that people say, I come to your website.

[00:20:29] I have to read this whole thing. Which is why commonly at a lot of food creator web websites, you’ll see jump to recipe at the top.

[00:20:37] Kris Ward: Yeah.

[00:20:37] Kate Ahl: You always wanna click that cuz then you can go, you can bypass that. But yeah, they’re optimizing for Google..

[00:20:43] Kris Ward: Because I don’t care how beautiful and blonde your children are, could I have this muffin recipe?

[00:20:47] Kate Ahl: Yes.

[00:20:47] Kris Ward: Because right now I’m fighting with my family and they want muffins, right? Enough.

[00:20:51] Kate Ahl: Yeah. Yeah. They’re playing the Google game.

[00:20:54] Kris Ward: Okay, so that’s another thing I didn’t understand. So what I’m not realizing is when I’m off Pinterest, so I think I’m still in Pinterest, but I’m not. So they’re pretty crafty about that.

[00:21:02] Cause I didn’t understand that either.

[00:21:03] Kate Ahl: Very.

[00:21:04] Kris Ward: So again, but if my user ends up on my pin or board, and then all of a sudden they’re looking at whatever I put up there. They would then be just like I was smoothly put over to my website. Which is helpful for Google traffic.

[00:21:18] Kate Ahl: Yes, very helpful. And then they can begin to get to know you. A common thing we see in Google Analytics too is that Pinterest users are pretty bouncy. So for example, like your muffins, they come here and they’re like, oh my gosh, you don’t wanna read this? Bounce. I go to the next one. I don’t wanna read this bounce, so you’ll see this high bounce rate, but then over time, as you start to build traffic, people will stay on your site a little bit longer.

[00:21:40] Kris Ward: Okay. Oh, alright. I’m gonna need a Pinterest nap after this cuz..

[00:21:45] Kate Ahl: I know, right?

[00:21:45] Kris Ward: It’s been awakening. Okay, so clearly you don’t know what you don’t know. I’ve said this a lot lately, but, so what else are we misunderstanding about the Pinterest journey?

[00:21:56] Kate Ahl: I would say one that it doesn’t take up a lot of time and it actually is not as overwhelming as you think. Once you master the basics, they don’t change a whole lot. So whereas when we feel like we master something on Instagram, it changes next Thursday, and we’re like oh, I can’t, you don’t use hashtags on Pinterest. You really just use it like your…. i, this is the best analogy. Every single time you put a pin onto the platform, it’s like you’re adding a log to the fire. You’re fueling it.

[00:22:26] Kris Ward: Oh, okay. Okay.

[00:22:27] Kate Ahl: So you’re telling the algorithm, “Hey, this is what my stuff is about. Hey, this is who you should show it to. “Like here, I’m gonna keep telling you. And there’s lots of tools like scheduling tools or Pinterest templates to really speed up the process. So some people who are super proficient at taking their content, putting on Pinterest, it doesn’t take them hours. And once you get it, you really get it. There’s some tweaks you can make to tactics, but overall, once you realize why you’re using it, we tell people to create like a strategy statement. I’m using Pinterest in order to grow my email list by sharing educational content.

[00:23:04] Okay. That’s my true north, right? I know that’s where I’m going. Okay, now I’m gonna take all these other things that I know could go on to Pinterest to fuel that. And I’m gonna keep feeding the machine over time. And I’m gonna watch my analytics to see, “Hey, my Pinterest audience, what are they like? What are they clicking on? What are they saving?”

[00:23:24] And it doesn’t require as much output from me, like I’m not ex, I would, if I could, in my own business, I would give up Instagram like a hot minute, right?

[00:23:37] Kris Ward: Yeah. Yeah.

[00:23:37] Kate Ahl: And I would only focus on Pinterest because it’s not draining and it really fuels the content part of me that loves to talk about those things.

[00:23:46] So I would say that to people is there is a hurdle. There’s usually just one or two. Once you get over that you can run the marathon. Like it’s pretty smooth and it’s not…

[00:23:57] Kris Ward: Well, and because Instagram, I tend to be on TikTok more than Instagram, but either or same thing, whatever. Yeah. And every day that ends with the letter Y there’s sky’s falling.

[00:24:07] This is what’s happening. We don’t do this anymore. That was so yesterday, the algorithm, this algorithm is like some sci-fi movie that’s always gonna bite us in the butt and we don’t know what, which ends up and then is this rumor or folklore or does it matter? And they’re ch checking, tricking the algorithm because they’re doing this and I can’t keep on top of it all. And you don’t even know if any of it’s true. So I think it’s more a consistent, caring long game in pinterest.

[00:24:31] Kate Ahl: Exactly. Okay. And one thing to note about that is I have been doing Pinterest marketing for nine years and been doing it for clients. And I will tell you, if there’s one person who wants to find a trick to game the system, I would be the first to try to find it.

[00:24:44] Because yeah, it could be advantageous. There’s no trick to Pinterest. There’s no real way to game the system. We can take two of our clients who put them side by side, maybe they talk about the same thing. They’re in the same space, and we will get completely different results by doing the same thing, simply because we don’t, it’s like a living organism over there.

[00:25:06] We don’t know how Pinterest is going to react. And when I say Pinterest, Piners. We don’t know who’s clicking, who’s saving and every indication that your pinner does tells the platform where to put it, but you can’t really control that with the exception of making great content. That’s it.

[00:25:24] Kris Ward: So it seems like they, the creator and the end user are closer and more direct.

[00:25:30] Kate Ahl: A hundred percent.

[00:25:32] Kris Ward: Okay, that’s profound. Oh my gosh. Okay. Where can we find more of your brilliance, Kate?

[00:25:39] Kate Ahl: I have a podcast, the Simple Pin Podcast where I’m just talking about Pinterest. I’ve been doing that for seven years now.

[00:25:45] Okay. So we try to keep you up to date on Pinterest, and I always tell people, just start listening. Don’t try to master anything right away. Just what you and I did in this podcast. Frame it up because when you frame it up, then you have a better understanding of going into it and we’ll experience less frustration. And then on, you’ll find all of our resources too as well.

[00:26:07] Kris Ward: Okay. Oh my gosh. Okay, everyone share this with a business buddy, because we’ve all been led astray. We didn’t know. Help them out. Share this podcast with one friend and we will see you happily in the next episode. Thank you so much, Kate.

[00:26:21] Kate Ahl: Yeah, you’re so welcome.