Branding Photography Tips And How To Make It Work! with Tanya Smith

Episode Summary

You can find Tanya Smith at:
Website: https://www.workstorycreative.com/
Email: tanya@workstorymedia.com
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tanya-goodall-smith-1808a12/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/workstorycreative

Win The Hour Win The Day
https://winthehourwintheday.com

Tanya Smith Podcast Recording

[00:00:35] Kris Ward: Hey, everyone. Welcome to another episode of Win The Hour, Win The Day. I am your host, Kris Ward. And today we have Tanya Goodall Smith in the house, and Tanya is going to talk to us under the umbrella of branding, but we’re going to dive into, I guess I don’t want to see photography, Tanya.

[00:00:53] We’re talking about using your picture and your branding photography. Is that, is that what you call it?

[00:00:59]Tanya Smith: Yeah. Yeah. Well, I feel like photography is a huge asset to your brand that people aren’t using effectively or wisely. And I’d love to help people change that. So…

[00:01:11]Kris Ward: Well, here’s the thing, just so we get it upfront. I, in what I would call myself, an extremely flawed human being. So I have like, there’s some things I have no understanding or patience for. So we, I’m going to tell you all my secrets. I’m going to tell you guys everything. Here’s the deal. When people, I want to highlight people who have been on my show as much as humanly possible in every way I can.

[00:01:35] So we used to have it that the cover would be a picture of me and them. And I’m telling you, Tanya, we had to stop that because high end what I would seem to be successful people, professionals that have been in business a while, they would send me these crazy low digitized pictures of them in their backyard.

[00:01:55] And like with the cell phone, you can take a full-on photo shoot with a professional or yourself with a phone. Like it’s not a matter of, ”Oh, I don’t have a camera or anything anymore.” Right? And we just had to stop doing it. Cause, I can’t think of a better word, I’m just going to say the crap they sent us was unbelievable and just became an obstacle.

[00:02:15] So now there’s just me on the cover. So I am shocked that we need to have this conversation, but, you know, and I said that to you in the beginning, we were talking, I’m like, all right, we can have this conversation, but do we need to tell people that? But apparently we do because I experienced it firsthand all the time to this point that we had to change.

[00:02:33] And I was really sad about changing. Cause I really wanted people to be, I know I liked being on the cover of somebody else’s podcast. Like it really adds validity there. So, you know, you’re a better person than me, start with me. Like, what are people thinking? How has this happened?

[00:02:47]Tanya Smith: Yeah, it’s a huge problem. I mean, I started as a graphic designer and same thing.

[00:02:51] People are like, we’re doing this billboard is costing thousands of dollars. Here’s our crappy picture. We took in our lobby, you know, with horrible lighting. And I’m like, you’re spending all this money on this ad and this photo’s not doing you any favor. So apparently it is something people still don’t get.

[00:03:09] So, and I’ve through the years, seen the obstacles and a lot of them are, people are afraid to get their picture taken which is ironic because they’re like, I don’t like the way I look in photos, but I’m going to send you this terrible photo. Like if you come to a professional that are going to help you look your absolute best that you can write with good lighting and posing and you know, the higher resolution. So it doesn’t make any sense. 

[00:03:34]Kris Ward: Yeah. Lighting is your friend and the whole world can change by anything. I would say to you as well, to me that’s a bad excuse because it’s almost like what if I said to you Tanya? Listen, I got this. I got this potential client for you and they are really up your alley.

[00:03:49] I think this would be really good contact for you. I’ve actually set up a meeting for you Friday at 10:00 AM. Well, you wouldn’t say “I don’t like how I look, so I’m not going to go.” 

[00:03:58]Tanya Smith: I know it’s so silly. It’s like this irrational fear, I guess. But then I think another one is they just don’t see the importance or the value.

You know, if someone comes to me when they have a marketing firm or a marketing department, they understand it, you know, they’re like we need better photos. And oftentimes the owner will be like, oh, that’s too expensive. We’re not going to spend our marketing money on photos, which is so backwards, right?

[00:04:22] Like all 90% of your ads or whatever is the photo. So that should be the highest priority. And you can use them in a million different ways. In fact, I created a download for everybody from this call with a hundred ways you can use photos to build your business. 

[00:04:40]Kris Ward: Okay. I’m pretty creative, but I’d like to see a hundred. Like I use them everywhere, but if you’ve made a download with a hundred, okay. Then sign me up, buttercup. Because I’m like, I could give you a good 25, but I don’t, I think I’d be pushing it at a hundred. And the thing is; listen, people. I’ll tell you tips I know just from a lot of years of experience. First of all, whatever, wear neutral colors, logo stripe patterns are not your friend because they draw the eye away from your face.

[00:05:08] That’s what fashion is about, changing and distraction and whatever. Right? So, but also when you wear neutral colors and your clothes are the backdrop, even if they’re bright colors, I now wear a lot of bright colors. That’s fine, but still. Then it’s a nice clean backdrop, your top. It’s not like ribbons and bows and lines and stripes and logos.

[00:05:27] And you can use those pictures. Like, you could easily get away with two years of using those pictures and using them everywhere. But then that leads to the next thing where people I’m like, that picture I met you when I first started my business 12 years ago, you had that picture and you should probably update that now.

[00:05:50]Tanya Smith: Yeah. That’s especially if your hair changed. If you don’t wear; if you wear glasses now or don’t wear glasses anymore, those kinds or you just, we age, you look like you are in real life in your picture, but you know, your best elevated self. 

[00:06:08]Kris Ward: Oh, my God. I’m horrible today. I’m sorry. I’m so passionate about this and just keep talking over you. I’m usually not this bad. Okay. I promise you it’s bad, but not this bad. Go ahead. My apologies. 

[00:06:17]Tanya Smith: Oh no, I think I was done, you know, like we want, I hate it when I see someone’s professional, even if they got a professional picture on their profile and you meet them online and then you meet them in real life and I’m like, I would not have recognized you on the street based on your picture. Right. So you want it to be professional, but also look like you.

[00:06:36]Kris Ward: Yeah, that I know. I remember one time, this guy, this was a long time ago and he handed me his business card and his picture was on it. Good on him. That’s great. And then I said, Hmm, I don’t think this… And I’m, I’m honest. I will tell people cause I’m really, truly trying to help.

[00:06:49] Right. I really care. And I said, you know, I don’t think this picture does do justice. And he says, yeah, they wouldn’t let me smile. And I said, who’s they? And he said, the passport people. Passport picture on his business card. I’m like, oh my gosh, like, what’s up? 

[00:07:08]Tanya Smith: So I guess my first tip would be like: invest in some photography, even if it’s just one headshot. Right? You go, you get a quick photo. Although I feel like in order to get the best look for you going and having an actual session where you’re trying different outfits. The photographer gets to know you, you can relax. So you can get the best expression and pose and that kind of thing. For you, it’s worth the investment.

[00:07:38] Like you said, you know, I do more extensive branding shoots where we create a library of images for people and I haven’t had clients who have used their photos for three years. Like it’s, you know, everywhere, you know, the value per use is huge for those photos.

[00:07:54]Kris Ward: You really can change the game, whether it’s your website, your brochure, or LinkedIn or anything by, you can make yourself go up.

And value what you deem to be, where like I’ve had people even back in the day when it was much newer and with my pictures, cause they were professionally done and people would say to me, well, we’d really like to hire you. We’re not sure we can afford you. And I was like, listen, you can afford me.

[00:08:17] Right. Cause I was really new, but they thought, because they looked so polished, right? Like, oh we can’t, we do afford you. Great. Excellent. So what is it you think you can afford? Cause I can make that price happen. Right. So I really truly believe. Okay. So if we have. Like, I can’t stress this enough people, listen, if you’re not sure, send it to Tanya or even me, and I’ll help you out and say, yeah, you need a new picture.

[00:08:41] But I think if you have to ask, you know, you need one and I do think there’s so much more important than you possibly understand. Okay. So give us some ideas of some of these crazy places you think we can put pictures. 

[00:08:54]Tanya Smith: Yeah. So, I mean, there’s the obvious social media profiles, right? And your website, your business cards.

But then, I mean, the sky’s the limit, right? There’s billboards, print ads, mail campaigns, like those things aren’t dead. In fact, they’re kind of becoming more of a novelty like, “Ooh, I got a thing in the mail.” 

[00:09:16]Kris Ward: One of my mentors, he’s very big on direct mail marketing. And right today, actually I’m working on a five-page speaker book, speaker brochure that everybody else emails, but he says, listen, the best part, Kris is nobody else is in their mailbox.

[00:09:29] So this looks better when it’s printed in color and they’re going to keep it in a mailbox or email box. They just either don’t open it or file it until later, but now it sits on their desk. So, absolutely. And of course that’s littered with high-end pictures of myself, which you can make yourself look so much better than you actually look.

[00:09:46]Tanya Smith: So then, I mean, there’s, if you’re writing a book, book cover or the book jacket, even if you’re printing a product for sale or to give us swag or anything like that. I really racked my brain to come up with two things.

[00:10:04]Kris Ward: Because here’s the thing, you know what? I have this little spreadsheet that I call, we call it Kris’s network.

And I learned a long time ago. The hard way is that I would make wonderful connections with people like you. And then, you know, you and I, it’s like having a sort of five dates. We’re talking to each other today. It’s like, oh, we have a really good time. And then I see you for a few weeks on social media.

[00:10:24] And then I interview a bunch of other people and you get moved down the feet. Right. And so what I realized was. I was rotating relationships instead of growing my network or maintaining them. And I thought this isn’t, this is a bad plan. And I lost contact with people that were really important to me in the business world, but I just didn’t keep on top of them.

[00:10:42] So now we have this little spreadsheet, we call it Kris’s network. So I make sure to go in once a month or reach out to someone or send a video, whatever. But I learned really quickly. Sometimes I look at someone’s name on, huh? Who are they? But in this spreadsheet, I have the name; first column, then picture of them.

[00:10:56] Second column. And the point in trying to drive home is that you remember faces so much more than you remember names. I don’t care who you are because funny story, we had two people that were actually on my show and they were similar in background. They both had red hair and they were both dynamic individuals.

[00:11:15] And one had said, I don’t think I’ve told this story in the show, when it said to me she was talking about weighted blankets, because if you people can imagine them a high energy, and that sounds great, but that’s not so great when you try to go sleep at night. So she said, oh, it was a game changer for, and whatever.

[00:11:28] I’m like, I’ve tried everything, whatever. But anyhow, I’m like, okay. So I tried this way to blanket. So I sent her email and I said, this has changed my life. I have tried everything. I love this more than words can say you are my new best friend. This is awesome, I went on and on. So I got the email back and she said, Kris, I am so happy for you.

[00:11:45] I have no idea what you’re talking about. I did not recommend this weighted blanket, but I am glad that you’re sleeping better. I had gotten mixed up because they were very similar and I’m like, well, this is dumb. So now I, you know, I’ve had the little spreadsheet, I see their face. I go, oh yeah, she’s the one that gave me this tip.

[00:12:02] She’s the one that I knew about this. Cause they know their faces. So your image really is everything which needs home. What you’re saying is it should be out there everywhere because you’re lucky if people remember your name, but if they remember your face that’s so powerful. And I was, I’m so sorry.

[00:12:20] You’re on my show, but I’m all excited about this. Let me say this one last thing. I’ll let you talk. I was just reading this other book on sales and he was talking about the home is Noma more putting your picture there all the time. And he’s saying, because people feel there’s a familiarity to you when they meet you.

[00:12:35] They’re already in the relationship because there’s such psychology behind the impact that they’ve seen your face a number of times. And that’s why, again, it’s so powerful. So there you go. 

[00:12:47]Tanya Smith: And also thinking about your social media profiles, especially, can we see your face? Like, we’re looking at our tiny little phones and people have this like full body picture and I’m like, I can’t see who this person is.

[00:12:58] So you want your profile? Full of your face. That’s one thing that annoys me all the time, but going back to some creative ways to use your pictures. I had one client where I live in Spokane, Washington, which is kind of, I mean,  it’s a medium sized city, but kind of has a reputation of being kind of Hicksville.

[00:13:16] And I had this engineering firm and they said, we’re very capable, you know, but we’re getting, we’re sending out bids and losing them to Seattle, even to local entities. And so they wanted to look more posh and modern. And so we did a photo shoot. They had this gorgeous office that had been newly renovated.

[00:13:37] And with the balcony of like, the backdrop was all the… like big buildings in Spokane. And so we took this amazing group photo of the partners and it looks like their website looked amazing because of the photos they looked really high-end and metropolitan. That’s what they wanted. So, I was surprised after, cause the website looked amazing.

[00:13:57] He said, when I send out a bid, I put this awesome picture of the partners on the bottom and say, you know, we would love to earn your business. And he said, he’s gotten so much feedback from that. You know, just like, look how amazing we are. 

[00:14:15]Kris Ward: It’s a difference between like, when you’re 19 and you go for a job, you know, and your mother might say, eat, dress up.

[00:14:21] You’re going to an interview like, oh mom, I’m just I’m. I might even go into an interview to be a garbage collector. It doesn’t matter. You have to show up, you know, with an, you have to show up ready for a job interview looking prepared. And that’s the thing is now they’ve pulled back the curtain and they look like, oh, these people look professional.

[00:14:37]Tanya Smith: Right. Yeah. And I just thought that was, I mean, it seems like a no-brainer, but a creative way to use your photo just in your email. Yeah. And it just communicated visually so many things about them that would counteract that prejudice thought that people might have because of where they were located.

[00:14:57]Kris Ward: Yeah. That’s it, you know, that’s a double thing you’re talking about. Like, first of all, you don’t look professional until you tell somebody and show somebody you are. And secondly, then the area was a liability. Also, I don’t know if it showed up here in this call, but I have an image on my zoom while you’re waiting.

[00:15:13] Yeah. And a lot of people don’t notice that it’s just, you know, I have one like bending over a desk saying, ‘Hey, I’ll be right with you.’ And it looks very inviting. So there’s little things like that. That once you put up, it’s done. I get a lot of comments about that and I totally forget it cause I don’t ever see it again.

[00:15:27] It’s just in my zoom profile. But while people are waiting, you can personalize your little message saying, ‘Hey, I’m just finishing up. We’ll be right with you.’ And then I’ve got this warm, busy looking picture of you cleaning up a desk and it’s like, oh, okay, she’ll be right here. Right. So it really, really does…. It’s kind of like your virtual handshake. 

[00:15:48]Tanya Smith: Right, or just the virtual you, right. It’s your avatar, you know, we’re connecting virtually everywhere. A lot of businesses don’t have a storefront anymore. Your pictures are your storefront. And yeah, like I said, they are you, online. So how are you showing up to the world in that way? That’s, you know the question you want to ask yourself regarding your photos. 

[00:16:10]Kris Ward: Okay. So hopefully for the love that all is pure in this world, please understand you need proper slash professional images. It’s an investment, it’s almost better like back in the day, when you were having to go out and do physical appointments.

[00:16:26] You know, think about the clothes you needed to buy. Now you buy one outfit in it too, and you take a bunch of pictures and you get a lot of usage on that. So it was really so economical that investment to get professional shots, so economical. So tell us some other mistakes you think, Tanya, that people are overlooking either the psychology of it or what they’re not doing with it?

[00:16:45] Like, you need to shut me up because I go crazy on this. I just don’t understand. I don’t understand how people don’t understand this. 

[00:16:53]Tanya Smith: Well, I think one thing, maybe people put it off because they don’t know who to hire. Right. That could be another thing. Or they got professional pictures and they didn’t like them, you know?

[00:17:04] And so some mistakes I see there are: they use their wedding photographer or their brother-in-law or something, you know, he doesn’t specialize in photos for marketing and branding. So that’s something to look for when you’re shopping. Right. Maybe if there are professionals in your area that have great photos, you could ask them, ‘Hey, who did your photos?’

[00:17:24] When you go look at their portfolio, look and see like, is there consistency? Do they specialize in this type of photography? Because if you’re only seeing babies and weddings. You know, there’s a high chance they don’t know how to deal with. 

[00:17:38]Kris Ward: Yeah, because the difference there is what I always say is a business portrait. Everybody wants to, like, it’s hard to look spontaneous and fun by yourself, and you’re trying to be a person and professional at the same time. Right. Whereas family portraits and weddings and hold the cute baby, there’s something to do where there’s not in a business portrait. So it really, truly is important.

[00:18:00] It really is a different type of photography, and you are usually dealing with people over 25. So I always say everybody wants to be taller, thinner, younger, whatever. And we all walk into the room with our, you know, things we don’t want to show off. Right? So you want a photographer that, you know, can manage that and, you know, just holding the camera is not a wedding photographer is not a baby photographer is not a business portrait. 

[00:18:27]Tanya Smith: Yeah. So find someone who specializes and then, especially if you’re doing more than just a headshot, well, even a headshot you need to go in with or, you know, at least have a photographer, that’s gonna prompt you into, you know, how do you want to be perceived in these photos?

[00:18:42] Do you want to be fun? Do you want to be serious? You know, what kind of vibe do you want to put out there?  And then like for my clients, if we’re doing that whole library of photos, we have planning meeting in advance. And I go through, it’s kind of like developing a brand. I’m asking them all these questions about who their audience is and what they offer.

[00:19:02] And then we plan out a shot list. So I see that as something missing sometimes too, you know, the photographer doesn’t help with that part. And then they show up and like, ‘Hey, what are we gonna shoot today?’ And then they aren’t prepared. Right. And that’s often why they don’t turn out well, the photos to ask for, you know, do you help me plan the shoot?What does that entail? 

[00:19:25]Kris Ward: Yeah, because I know too there’s fashion in photography, meaning that banker look that was heavy, say 10, 15 years ago is not the thing anymore. Do we all need headshots? Yes. You need a headshot to have it in your… you need to have one in your toolbox, but it is not the primary thing anymore.

[00:19:42] I would say it’s probably an 80-20 ratio where it, before it used to be like, oh, you just need a headshot. Right. So you don’t need that. And then also too, it does make a big difference. Like I know when I was younger, if I said, oh, I’m getting this wild hair cut to me. It meant cutting my bangs into my sister meant blue hair.

[00:19:56] Like, you know what I mean? She get a blue and purple hair. And that was like being creative. And I was like, did you see my bangs? I cut them. Like, they’re shorter than they were pulling shorter. Look at me. I’m wild. Right? So you can’t be showing up there and saying, I want to look fun. Well, what does fun mean to you?

[00:20:15] So I think that’s really important. Understanding that really the photographer is supposed to be the creative director and work with you for the message you want to portray. It’s not a matter of slapping you up against the wall, like your driver’s license picture, right? 

[00:20:29]Tanya Smith: Yeah, for sure. And that takes time. Right. So understanding this probably isn’t going to be a 15 minute thing, you know, like it’s going to take some time. And then, another mistake I see people making is just hiring someone based on price, right? Like, she was a photographer that you like, and that you get along with that you like their photos.

[00:20:50] And, you know, I mean, you’re probably not going to hire any legal cause that’s going to cost a hundred thousand dollars, but there’s someone locally in your area, you know, if you feel like it’s too expensive, just, you know, it’s part of your marketing budget and branding, you know, be prepared to invest some money in this.

You know, I often think we just don’t realize how much it’s going to cost or value it and see the value? 

[00:21:18]Kris Ward: If you take what you do, whatever the number, let’s just be silly and say it was a thousand dollars, right. Let’s just be silly. Sky’s the limit with Jennifer Lopez, a thousand older business portrait, right?

[00:21:30] And what I’m just round numbers, whether that’s high or low. If you think about how often you’re going to use that for the next two or three years in everything, you are literally spending pennies on this. Pennies. And also you get to show up, like I often think of back in the day, like I went virtual long before anybody else, because I was like, oh my gosh.

[00:21:50] Even if my client was down the street, right. Everything’s on my computer. I can just hit a button and go to the next appointment instead of including travel time and waiting for them to come to their office, blah, blah, blah. Right. So what I realized was that, you know, if you’re utilizing these pictures back in the day, when I had to go to physical meetings, do you have like, oh, you, you, I got to get dressed.

[00:22:12] I’ve got outside appointments today. I have to put on my suit, all this, you get to spend the time with a professional, make yourself look good for an hour or two. And then you can sustain that polished look for the next three years. Like it’s still frozen in time because you’ve got those pictures out there.

[00:22:29] Whereas if you’re meeting somebody physically, you’re like, oh my gosh, you didn’t sleep last night. Or I, that thing is still in the laundry or it’s raining. And I look awful. I showed up trying to get business. I looked like a wet dog. So you are putting your… you’re being strategic about your best foot forward.

And then you can use this. Like crazy for the next few years. So it really is quite an effective investment. 

[00:22:52]Tanya Smith: Right. Right. And having a library of images too, saves you so much time because say, you know, I’m on your podcast or like, ‘Hey, we need a photo of you.’ I can just go grab it and send it. I’m not like, oh, can someone take my picture?

[00:23:05] I’m an attorney and take a selfie or the social media too. It’s huge. Right? You need tons of content for your social media. If you’ve just got these things planned out based on subjects you regularly talk about for your blog and your social media, you just have them there and they look good and it’s done, right? You don’t have to think about it again. 

[00:23:25]Kris Ward: I’ve even had to say to people like we took, as I said, in the beginning of the show, we took them off the cover we had to, and then still we need their pictures for other things. And then I had to say to someone really nicely, could you please send me one without a baseball cap?

[00:23:40] Like… Do you have any without a baseball cap, really I’d appreciate that. And this is not a professional baseball coach. This is an entrepreneur with a thriving business. Could you please do anything without that cap? I would just find that fantastic. That would move this project along. Thank you. And my team went back and forth three, four times asking for pictures until I had to get involved.

[00:24:02] And I feel like saying, listen, I don’t, you know, I don’t even know how to make this sound nicely in an email. Like I don’t get it. I don’t get it. So stop hiding from it. It’s just not something that you can keep putting off. It is everything. And it also really frustrates people like me. I’m not coming off good in this show, but if you don’t know by now, I’m impatient.

[00:24:23] What is, does then you bring down the quality of my show is if I’m putting a cover out and you look like you just rolled in off the street and you don’t even know how to spell the word business, like it brings down my brand. Like you talk about how pictures bring up a brochure. Well, then that’s why we take stopped putting people on the cover.

[00:24:41] Cause you’re like, you’re making me look like I’m recording this in the bathroom and I’ve got all this expensive stuff that I’ve invested into this show and you’re bringing down the quality of that. So people don’t want,… they don’t want to be interacting with you if you make them look bad. 

[00:24:57]Tanya Smith: Yeah. I write for several magazines and I’m friends with some editors and they’ve told me like, one of the things we consider to let someone write for us is whether or not they have good pictures.

[00:25:07] Or yeah, or like a feature, you know, like, ‘Hey, I’m going to have you feature my, you know, they send a press release.’ If they have bad pictures, we’re not going to publish them. Right. And that, yeah, that translates to a lot of  what you’re trying to do to promote your business.

[00:25:25]Kris Ward: Yeah. It downgrades the quality, it’s just like showing up to a business meeting, wearing slippers or shoes with holes in them.

[00:25:33] Like, you know, is that fair? Does somebody.. Are they smart? Should we not be judging a book by its cover? Well, I’ll tell you this. I’ve written a book, Win The Hour, Win The Day, and now I know a lot of authors from going through that experience. And one thing we all say is, listen, if you say you shouldn’t judge a book by its cover, you clearly never tried to sell a book, right?

[00:25:55] Yeah. So that’s how it is. Yeah. All right. So I hope you guys got something out of this other than going. I’m tired of listening to Kris rant, but I do. I’m so passionate about this because I see people totally get in their own way and really bring down the amount of opportunity that they have because they’re putting these hack shot images out there, and it’s just, it’s damaging

[00:26:19] beyond what you guys understand, because nobody’s even going to tell you what that picture makes them feel like they just assume their decision is right. Like, oh, I thought she was really experienced. Oh, I think she’s just starting out because look at her stuff, look at her images because she’s showing up.

[00:26:34] So no one’s going to clarify that with you. They just make that decision, move on. Like you said, about the magazine, they’re not going to say had you had a better picture. We would have let you write an article. No, they just make a decision and they move on.

[00:26:47]Tanya Smith: Right. Yeah. People are losing business. I have this one story. So, when I first started my business, I was looking for a business coach and someone recommended this coach. So I went to his website or his LinkedIn and his photo looked like a mugshot. Seriously. Like I would look at him. I feel fear, like I’m conscious of this stuff. So I knew like from his picture, I felt all these feelings, so I didn’t contact him.

[00:27:14] And then through the next few months, several of my friends were like, oh yeah, I use this guy for my coach. And I was like, really? So after like eight people said they loved the sky as their coach. I finally called him. But imagine how business he was potentially losing or how much sooner he would have had me as a client.

[00:27:33] If I went, I was like, oh, this guy looks professional. I’m interested. So, and he doesn’t even know that was happening. I actually brought it up to him later and I was like, ‘Hey, you should get a better picture because this is what is happening.’ Because of this photo. And I don’t need to spend money on that.

[00:27:51] It’s not important, you know? But he did. Oh, that’s okay. Well, yeah, he was like, a lot of people were like, oh, I don’t need to spend money on a picture. Like it’s not driving my boat forward or whatever, but it really is holding you back. So, yeah, I guess if we accomplish anything from this today, ‘Hey, it’s important to get a professional photo.’ 

[00:28:14]Kris Ward: And I’m so sorry. I am usually better than this, but this makes me crazy. Cause I just don’t understand it. And I think what your point was you could, he could have had six months more of income from you because you would have been there six months earlier. And then imagine if during that time you gave him another referral or two.

[00:28:30] Right. So that’s money there, people. So yes, I do apologize publicly and officially detention. I talked on over, but I just, this makes me crazy because it really does, like I said, it causes problems and I’m when I’ve done a great, usually we ask for, you know, your bio and stuff up front before the show, but even in the beginning I would give people the benefit of the doubt and I’d say, oh my gosh, that’s a bad picture. 

So then I’d say to them, if they show up, like, listen, you’re a great guest. This is awesome. But I do want to make sure. I’ve looked at your bio and I do need a better picture. Oh, no problem.

[00:29:03] I’ll send you one and then you just get an equally bad one. I’m like, well now what am I going to do? Do I not hear this? Like, yeah. And it just gets to a point where I don’t know how to say, listen, sir, you need to have, like take that wife-beater t-shirt off and send me something better. Right?

[00:29:20] So anyhow, I digress. I ranted enough. She is really smart. Check her out online, maybe listen to her on another podcast where she gets to talk more. But in fairness, I am agreeing with everything you’re saying passionately. So I am, I am a fan, I believe in your mission. Okay. Where can people find more of your brilliant stuff?

[00:29:41]Tanya Smith Yeah. So workstorycreative.com. And if you want to grab that download of the ‘A Hundred Ways..’ which I should add zoom profile. That was a good idea. That’s workstorycreative.com/a100ways. So 1, 0, 0. 

[00:29:57]Kris Ward: Okay. And we’ll make sure to put that in the show notes. Okay. Tanya, you are spectacular. Thank you so much. I’m so glad we connected. And everyone else, we will see you in the next episode. 

 END[00:30:08]Tanya Smith: Thank you.