The TTABS Formula for Predictable B2B Sales! with Chaz Horn

Episode Summary

You can find Chaz Horn at:
Email: chazhorn@chazhorn.com
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/chaz-horn/

#B2BSales
#SalesStrategy
#KrisWard

Chaz Horn Podcast Interview

[00:00:00] Kris Ward: Hey, everyone. Welcome to another episode of Win The Hour Win The Day. I am your host, Kris Ward, and today in the house we have Chaz Horn. He has the methodology and he is the author to B2B Blueprint 2 (two) predictable sales. Welcome to the show, Chaz. 

[00:00:16] Chaz Horn: Kris, it’s awesome to be here. I’m excited for our conversation. Let’s have some fun. 

[00:00:20] Kris Ward: Yeah, me too. Okay. So it’s no secret. Every business needs sales. That’s just, that is the blood, the lifeline. Without it, we got nothing, right? We got, nothing means nothing until people’s you know, I always say someone’s Oh, I got this client that’s interested in me. Until they pay, it’s not a sale, right?

[00:00:37] Kris Ward: So sales are important. We love what we do. We want to provide great value. But at the end of the day, we do need to have an income to sustain business. So this is a really important topic. So I know you have what we call this tabs formula. So I think we should just dive right into it. What do you think?

[00:00:55] Chaz Horn: Let’s rock. Let’s jump into it. 

[00:00:56] Kris Ward: Okay. Where do you want to start with [00:01:00] it? 

[00:01:00] Chaz Horn: Let’s start with the foundation. 

[00:01:01] Kris Ward: Okay. 

[00:01:02] Chaz Horn: And then we can back into it because sales is important. But most businesses miss a key component and that’s why sales are difficult. So if we look at tabs, TTABS. Yes, everyone out there, my tabs has two T’s and there’s a reason for that.

[00:01:23] Chaz Horn: So TTABS, those five things. You need to have working in unison, in alignment, congruently, in order to identify, attract, and onboard new clients. I’ll go over it, just overview, and then we can dive in deeper to each letter. Okay. It’s tactic, what you do, technique, that’s how you execute on the tactic.

[00:01:45] Chaz Horn: A – this is the foundation. It’s your attitude. It’s your mindset. And it’s not just about, hey, I’m going to have a, It’s about going with the intention to serve, not sell, and you will attract and not repel. That’s the first [00:02:00] page of my Dr. Seuss sales book for kids. 

[00:02:04] Kris Ward: Okay. 

[00:02:04] Chaz Horn: Okay. And then B is the behaviors, the KPI.

[00:02:09] Chaz Horn: How many of the tactics with the right technique and attitude than s that strategy, and that has to do with marketing. So that’s an overview, and we can jump into how they all work together and why it’s important to have all five of those in alignment with one another. 

[00:02:27] Kris Ward: Okay. Let’s go. I’m like, he got me at tactics, what you do, 

[00:02:31] Chaz Horn: right?

[00:02:32] Chaz Horn: So a lot of companies, they look at a demographic search. You have someone who’s in your geographic area with a founder who’s in your industry or the certain industry, a certain size company. And there’s a 3 percent rule, which says 3 percent of people in a demographic search are ready to make buying decision.

[00:02:54] Chaz Horn: So think about this. Many businesses even go to LinkedIn or sales navigator, do a [00:03:00] demographic search. Wow. Look at all these leads. And I’m using quotation marks for those listening to the podcast. And those aren’t leads what I consider a lead. And so reaching out to people cold, it’s an effort in futility.

[00:03:17] Chaz Horn: You can still make sales, but it’s very difficult. So what I like to do is look at leverage and I like to look at psychographic versus demographic. 

[00:03:28] Kris Ward: Okay. 

[00:03:29] Chaz Horn: Psycho, not psycho. 

[00:03:31] Kris Ward: Okay. 

[00:03:31] Chaz Horn: But we don’t need any psychos in our life. Psychographic are people in your demographic who actually put their hand up and said, you know what you’re talking about here I’m interested in.And so instead of having a tactic and reaching out to people, cold DMs or cold calls, put on an event. With the event, you’re going to talk to a specific need within your target audience, and you’re going to show them that you are an authority, so they have confidence that you could potentially solve their problem.

[00:04:02] Chaz Horn: Now, everyone that registers for that event, they’re in your psychographic, if they’re in your demographic, if that makes sense. Yeah. Okay. Now. They show up to the event. Now there’s a strategy, that’s S, in how to put on the event so you’re actually speaking to those main needs and wants. Sun Tzu, from The Art of War, said, Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat.

[00:04:28] Chaz Horn: But, he also said, Strategy without tactics is the slowest route to victory. You need both of those? Okay, and you’ve just if you’re just doing a cold outreach, whatever that is, without having a strategy and tactic working together in alignment with one another, then you’re going to miss speaking to people.

[00:04:50] Chaz Horn: And it’s going to be difficult to get those conversations because they don’t know you like you trust you and they don’t see you as an authority. 

[00:04:57] Kris Ward: Okay. So in one half of my brain, [00:05:00] I want to say, my God, is anybody doing cold calls? Like what, how do you get out of bed in the morning if you have to do that?

[00:05:07] Kris Ward: But on the other hand, I know I go into LinkedIn and you say hello to somebody and all of a sudden you get this very detailed, aggressive, totally inappropriate pitch for their business. So I guess people are doing it. So to me it’s I feel like why are we even talking about that? Cause cold calls, like they just don’t work in my mind.

[00:05:25] Kris Ward: But I think to your bigger point, the tactic is, all right, you’re right. I think people go into LinkedIn and say, they do a search and say, okay, there’s this many people that call themselves on founders and LinkedIn. Let’s say I’m looking for my clients, the majority of them tend to have one to three people on their team.

[00:05:42] Kris Ward: We deal with definitely bigger companies, but the majority of one to three. So then I would go in and do this search and do this stuff and narrow down. And you’re right, I have heard people call that leads, when it’s not leads, it’s just bodies. It’s just information. No one showed any interest.

[00:05:56] Kris Ward: So I think even that point there you made is an important one. Just [00:06:00] because, it’s if you go into a high school and you’re, I don’t know, you’re in grade 12 and you’re a female and you’re looking for a boyfriend just because there’s, 400 boys at that school does not mean they’re potential boyfriends.

[00:06:10] Kris Ward: You know what I mean? I, so I think even that part is really important is that they’re not leads, then you’re saying, all right, we don’t want to get into the whole hosting an event. Do we have to host an event that can sound overwhelming to people, but having some prequalifier where you’re saying whether it’s opting into something or whatever, they’re raising their hand in some way to show some level of interest so that then they’re stepping forward versus and limiting the search so that you don’t go from, you go from 5, 000 down to maybe 500, which is helpful, right?

[00:06:43] Kris Ward: Cause it saves you time. So I think that tactic part is really important. So make sure that we have a tactic to distinguish who is actually even lukewarm interested in our services. Is that the theme there? 

[00:06:57] Chaz Horn: Yes. And for [00:07:00] entrepreneurs, founders, there’s more people starting businesses than any other time in history because it’s so easy to, so a lot of times people are like, Oh, putting on an event.

[00:07:10] Chaz Horn: It’s easy. It’s simple, but people, even if you’re like saying, Oh, I don’t know, Chaz, I had one client who had was terrified of doing a live event. So what we did with him is we created another strategy where he created a newsletter and the newsletter was to speak to his target audiences main need and want.

[00:07:32] Chaz Horn: And you cannot have a strategy, marketing, that’s effective if you don’t know the main need, want, of your clients. Okay. And you don’t speak to it in a way that they have confidence that you actually know what you’re doing. And that you could potentially solve their problem. For him, we created a poll that said, what is your main problem with blank?

[00:07:53] Chaz Horn: This is the main need his target audience had. And then he had a couple questions that they [00:08:00] answered. Everyone who responded to that poll, It was in his target audience. He reached out to him and said, thanks for taking my poll. And he was able to schedule a meeting with them. He said, would you be interested in just a brief conversation?

[00:08:14] Chaz Horn: I’d like to interview you for my newsletter. 

[00:08:16] Kris Ward: Okay. 

[00:08:17] Chaz Horn: So it was a warm demographic, not demographic, not just demographic, but psychographic who answered a problem they had. And then they, he backed into it and said, we have a newsletter and I’d like to get, have an interview. Would you be opposed to that? David, have a conversation.

[00:08:36] Chaz Horn: With the person and he increased Appointments 3x just by doing this method as opposed to just the cold outreach 

[00:08:45] Kris Ward: Right 

[00:08:46] Chaz Horn: and when you have a 10 minute interview, because here we are interviewing one another you get to know and understand people Yeah and yeah become familiar and comfortable with you.

[00:08:54] Chaz Horn: So many of those Turned into clients at a much higher level. So that’s a different tactic, but [00:09:00] it’s incorporating strategy and Technique and how you’re going about it, right? 

[00:09:06] Kris Ward: Yeah, no, I like it. Oh and I like it too that we’re not just pinning it down if somebody hears event It’s I have to do event. So there are Yeah, there are definitely options for putting that tactic in play to warming, you know to just to identifying who is You know, somebody that’s interested in your services.

[00:09:24] Kris Ward: Okay. So we’ve got tactic now technique. 

[00:09:30] Chaz Horn: So technique has a lot to do with how you execute on the tactic. 

[00:09:33] Kris Ward: Okay. 

[00:09:34] Chaz Horn: And. It can be, I was speaking with a company who they’re looking to expand their company. So they’re hiring sales reps. And so in the sales process, we were doing some role plays and some of the new sales reps are just very monotone, talking like this, no tonality, body language, communication, influence, and communication is 7 percent words, [00:10:00] 38 percent tone.

[00:10:02] Chaz Horn: And 55 percent body language. So if you’re just using the words and you don’t have the right tone and the body language, then your tactics going to miss the mark because you’re not going to reach people on the emotional level. Okay. So for the people I was talking to, they were having a problem with, I’m not interested.

[00:10:24] Chaz Horn: And so the technique we used is agreement to lower their walls. And seeding just like planting seeds on a farm. So they were to receive this objection. I’m not interested. You know what? Now this is early in the conversation, and they’re moving from cold outreach to warm outreach from demographic to psychographic, but they’re not quite there because they just started working with them.

[00:10:50] Chaz Horn: So it’s about small little steps. One percent rule, James Clear, if you’re familiar with that. [00:11:00] 37 times further ahead in 12 months. 

[00:11:03] Kris Ward: Okay. 

[00:11:04] Chaz Horn: Yeah, it helped the British cycling team go from no Tour de France’s in a hundred years to four out of the next six years winning it. So we’re doing 1 percent improvements.

[00:11:14] Chaz Horn: So they get the I’m not interested. So we agreed to lower their walls. This is the technique. It’s you know what? I was looking at your LinkedIn profile and thought, he may not be interested. Now we did seating because we may not be able to help him like we did Doug, who we reduced his tax liability by 2.

[00:11:35] Chaz Horn: 1 million and his utility costs by 1. 9 million. Tell you what, I know you’re not interested. In the future, if you were ever to be interested in blank, this is their product. What are two things that you would need to see and hear? That’s using a technique with agreeing and ceding. I’m ceding them because what do founders care about?[00:12:00] 

[00:12:00] Chaz Horn: Cash. Yeah. 

[00:12:01] Kris Ward: Yeah, no 

[00:12:01] Chaz Horn: i’m saying 2. 1 million here in actual stories. It’s not about making something up never lie Okay, now there’s your seating and those thoughts take birth, not birth, but they sprout in their mind. Most, and most of the time they say I’d like to see an ROI. 

[00:12:17] Kris Ward: Yeah, so

[00:12:18] Chaz Horn: they are able to shift that around by having the tactic with the right technique, but you have to have the right attitude and that’s A.

[00:12:26] Chaz Horn: So let’s back up for a second. 

[00:12:27] Kris Ward: So most of our audience, myself included, we’re not dealing with the 2. 1 million. So we’re saying, okay, the technique is, can you give us a technique that would relate to a smaller business owner? 

[00:12:39] Chaz Horn: If you’re a smaller business owner, if you have a client that does, in my world, okay, just with talking with entrepreneurs, typically I would do this.

[00:12:50] Chaz Horn: They’re scheduling or they’re onboarding a new client every month. 

[00:12:54] Kris Ward: Yeah. 

[00:12:55] Chaz Horn: And so I get them to onboarding a new client weekly. And so if I was talking to [00:13:00] you, Kris, and I said, you know what, you said, Chaz, I’m not really not interested if this was a cool, not really a warm, I figured you weren’t.

[00:13:07] Chaz Horn: I was looking at your profile and I thought, you know what? We may not be able to help Kris like I did Melvin, who we moved from one client every six weeks to two clients every week. I get you’re not interested right now, but in the future, if you were, what would you need to see and hear to be interested?

[00:13:28] Chaz Horn: Okay. What would be important to you? Okay. Make sense? 

[00:13:31] Kris Ward: Yeah. Okay. So we’re explaining, the technique is on our side with the sales, not the technique, we’re not necessarily sharing our technique with the prospect. You’re showing us a technique of leveraging that. 

[00:13:44] Chaz Horn: Yeah. Tabs is everything. It’s not an external, it’s internal and how you reach the prospect and convert them into a client.

[00:13:53] Kris Ward: Fabulous. Okay. That makes sense. All right. So the attitude, which has gotten us all wrong, like we’ve all had [00:14:00] trouble with our attitude. I always thought that was a cop out in school and they’d say they don’t like your attitude. Okay. How are you qualifying that? Come on. 

[00:14:08] Chaz Horn: You’re tood. Yeah. 

[00:14:10] Kris Ward: Yeah. 

[00:14:11] Chaz Horn: So on your attitude, it’s. Yes, we need to have here. We are you and your prospects are equals, but you are the authority. And if you don’t show up as the authority guiding and directing the process, it’ll end up what I call the mess prince mess principle. It’ll end up a mess for you and for them.

[00:14:33] Chaz Horn: Okay. And so you need to show up as the authority. And you also need to show up with the intention to serve. Sales is not about getting people to buy the thing you want to sell them. It’s about helping people burst through those obstacles and helping them achieve goals. When you have that framework and you go with the intention to serve, you’re going to ask the difficult questions.

[00:14:58] Chaz Horn: So you uncover the [00:15:00] information. You’re going to be assertive, not aggressive. So you can get them from point A. To point C, because if they don’t become your client, if they’re a good fit, 

[00:15:10] Kris Ward: right? 

[00:15:10] Chaz Horn: If they don’t become a client, you’re not going to be able to serve them at the highest level. That’s why I say, and I joked about it, but not really.

[00:15:18] Chaz Horn: If you go with the intention to serve, not sell, you will attract and not repel. 

[00:15:23] Kris Ward: Okay. 

[00:15:24] Chaz Horn: Makes sense. 

[00:15:25] Kris Ward: It does because I think you’re right. I always say too, we’ve had other conversations about this, like with Bob Burg and stuff like that. They also can smell it off you when you’re coming in with that sort of hunger.

[00:15:38] Kris Ward: So if you’re going at it and you have this, what I call a strategy call or some sort of sales conversation, then when you’re serving and you’re feeling good about that, you’re not, you have a A more broad goal and you don’t feel like you failed at the end of that, should it not be a good fit and you don’t get them as a client. So I think it changes. Sure. 

[00:15:59] Chaz Horn: Cause you said [00:16:00] something that was really important. So I’m working with this entrepreneur and he goes, Oh, I said, so what’s your process look like? I meet with them and then I have a proposal. I said, is that what you tell your prospect? Yeah. Okay. So they’re coming in knowing that you’re going to try to sell them.

[00:16:16] Chaz Horn: Guess so. Change it. You need to name that meeting with something that adds value for them. Like for instance, I have an, I have a solopreneur I’m meeting with here in about an hour and a half, and I’m doing a gap analysis. 

[00:16:32] Chaz Horn: The gap analysis is to get absolute clarity on where he is, where he wants to go, what are those potential, what are those obstacles he’s facing now, so that we can uncover that and there should be an aha moment for both of us.

[00:16:48] Chaz Horn: And at that time, if I can help you, then I can give you a step by step process. So it’s not a proposal, presentation, something. Name that. Yeah. So they see [00:17:00] value in it. So it’s not Oh, I’m going to try to get sold. And so they go into the conversation with an understanding, I’m here to get clarity and everybody wants clarity.

[00:17:11] Kris Ward: I believe in that. We call it a strategy session. And I also do the type of people I work with, they’re just working way too many hours for where they are at this point in their journey. And one of the things that really upsets me is that these people are very smart, efficient, they’re often the go-to person for a lot of people in their life.

[00:17:28] Kris Ward: And so they get this false sense of there’s just too much to work to do ’cause if I can’t do it, I’m the one that gets the most done. How can it get done? And so then they start blaming themselves. I need to be more organized or more disciplined, or more so I feel if they lead that strategy call, whether they’re a potential client or not.

[00:17:43] Kris Ward: Understanding that it’s not about flaws in their character, that their setup is not allowing that, like they just can’t sustain it with the current setup they have, and they’re following, the corporate model, and there’s some basic things I won’t get into. If they leave with that, [00:18:00] I feel good because they can stop beating themselves up.

[00:18:02] Kris Ward: So redefining really what the situation is, whether they’re going to become my client or not. So I feel good about that. If they understand that, I feel I’ve done my job. 

[00:18:11] Chaz Horn: Amen to that. And that’s why I love with what you do because that’s been a huge struggle my entire life. Yeah. And so giving clarity to our prospects and when you do that in such a way

[00:18:23] Chaz Horn: where you’re serving them with the right attitude as the authority and you have the right marketing so they come into the conversation not cold, but having a sense of knowing you, liking you, trusting you, seeing you as the authority. Many people that I meet with, they’re like, man, I’ve been following your content for two years.

[00:18:39] Chaz Horn: I’m like, really? Most of those people don’t engage the interested parties. It’s like Pareto’s principle 80, 20. 

[00:18:46] Chaz Horn: Even it’s probably more like 90, 10. So they come into the conversation because of content. They know who I am. And so that’s the strategy with just general content marketing. That helps people know you.

[00:18:59] Chaz Horn: And so when they get into the [00:19:00] conversation, it’s a whole different conversation. 

[00:19:02] Kris Ward: Yeah. Yeah. Amen to that. Okay. All right. So we’ve got, actually we have behavior. 

[00:19:09] Chaz Horn: So when you talk about people that I meet with, and typically on LinkedIn, solopreneurs, consultants, coaches, small businesses, one to five.

[00:19:22] Chaz Horn: Employees. And they’re like I’m on LinkedIn and we have this demographic search and their leads, LinkedIn sales navigator calls them leads. 

[00:19:31] Kris Ward: Yeah. 

[00:19:32] Chaz Horn: And so they’re just sending out massive amounts of direct messages, spending lots of times commenting on lots of posts, getting out content, but they don’t know what content to put out, what to say, how to say it, but because they haven’t had clarity.

[00:19:47] Chaz Horn: So when you don’t have. If you have a strategy in place, you’ll do a lot more behaviors. Behaviors is the KPI. One company I worked with, a [00:20:00] small company that had one salesperson, they were making a hundred cold calls. This guy was making a hundred cold calls a day. He was scheduling one and a half meetings.

[00:20:07] Chaz Horn: Okay, that’s a lot of time. 

[00:20:09] Kris Ward: I cannot tell you how I don’t think I could get out of my pajamas if you told me I had to cold calls all day long, never mind a hundred, I just, I don’t even, words fail me, I just wouldn’t have a job, but go ahead, sorry. 

[00:20:22] Chaz Horn: Yeah, no, you’re good, I feel the exact same way.

[00:20:24] Chaz Horn: Yeah. And so their KPI, their behaviors was a hundred the expectations and we can get into expectations versus standards. When you expect certain things, you just sap the morale out of your people. It’ll sap the morale out of you with two, you had to have standards that you operate your values you operate from.

[00:20:44] Chaz Horn: But so we shifted them from that to doing a similar strategy, which I talked about earlier where they had an ebook that they created. For their prospects, they gave them value. [00:21:00] And so they had people that were opting in for the book. They also did a poll and then they were reaching out. So they did 25 warm calls and three X, the meetings that they had.

[00:21:12] Chaz Horn: So they’re doing, it’s actually more like. More than three X, they’re doing six meetings a week instead of or a day as opposed to one and a half by doing, 

[00:21:23] Kris Ward: I’m sure you’re good at, you’re good at what you do. Let me tell you that, but I’m here to, I’m sure, but boy, oh boy, didn’t somebody in that company say.

[00:21:31] Kris Ward: To make a hundred sales calls, we get one client. That means we have to make 200 to get two. Like those are bad. You don’t have to.

[00:21:38] Chaz Horn: That’s just the meetings. That’s not the clients. That’s just the meetings. 

[00:21:42] Kris Ward: That’s not, you don’t have to be good at numbers or business to know that is not a good or sustainable plan.

[00:21:48] Chaz Horn: That’s why when you know and understand tabs, it’s like you, you can, with tabs, when you know it, it’s like we’re making, we’re spending three hours to schedule one and a half [00:22:00] meetings. And then from that, Oh, you’re right. Oh my gosh. Then we’re closing 20 percent of those. And so now we’re like, what do we need to look at?

[00:22:08] Chaz Horn: Oh, we don’t have a strategy in place. 

[00:22:11] Kris Ward: Hold on. You brought up a really good point and I skipped it. You’re saying They got one meeting out of the hundred, not a sale. So now you get, you’re not going to get a hundred percent sales out of a hundred percent meetings. Oh my gosh, this is even work. Oh my Lord have mercy.

[00:22:24] Kris Ward: I would, I’d have a drinking problem like nobody’s business. Okay. All right. All right. Strategy. So when we talk about tabs and strategy. 

[00:22:37] Chaz Horn: Yeah. So this is, I started thinking about, cause I was in sales my entire life, several decades. And a lot of it was cold outreach and I didn’t, I was like, I, this is stupid.

[00:22:49] Chaz Horn: Even way back when. 

[00:22:50] Kris Ward: This sucks, man. 

[00:22:52] Chaz Horn: Exactly. Yeah. So I was always looking at strategy and I wasn’t thinking about, Oh, [00:23:00] here’s the strategy. I was just thinking about leverage. I remember sitting in front of, I was doing some follow up calls one night late because I wanted to be top in sales, provide for my family.

[00:23:15] Chaz Horn: And my son who had these big eyes had this pouty faces, daddy, can you play? I go, I gotta work Tyler. And so I still have that picture ingrained in my mind. Daddy had to work because i’m following up with people Because they’re not responding because they don’t know me because i’m reaching out without a strategy. So i’m I thought right then and there how can I reach?

[00:23:37] Chaz Horn: Multiple people without doing cold out and I started without doing cold outreach I started thinking about who I knew that served the same target audience as me 

[00:23:45] Kris Ward: Okay, 

[00:23:46] Chaz Horn: and I remember thinking of this consultant who worked for the company I worked for And he had a CEO round table and I asked him, his name is Joe Edwards.

[00:23:57] Chaz Horn: I said, Joe, can I speak [00:24:00] to your CEOs about what I was selling at the time? It was a technology offer and talk about some of the places they’re vulnerable if they didn’t do X, Y, and Z. He said, sure, I’m always looking for speakers. So in our meeting with these 12 round table, 525, 000 sale. So that’s the difference between having it on it.

[00:24:22] Chaz Horn: Now this way I’m using kind of a collaboration with somebody. Yeah. 

[00:24:27] Kris Ward: Yeah. 

[00:24:27] Chaz Horn: He needs a speaker. I have an expertise in this area that can help them. 

[00:24:34] Kris Ward: Yeah. 

[00:24:34] Chaz Horn: With cybersecurity at the time. And so we came, I was, I got a third party endorsement. So they came already seeing me as an authority. And then I touched on some buttons and there was this guy who had 21 restaurants whose PCIs or payment system was hacked.

[00:24:51] Chaz Horn: And so he needed to become PCI compliant. Or he wasn’t going to be able to take a visa. Oh my. Yeah, 525, 000 [00:25:00] sale for an hour. 

[00:25:02] Kris Ward: Yeah. 

[00:25:02] Chaz Horn: Just talking and just having an open conversation with people. So that’s a strategy, is collaboration in leveraging other people’s audiences that they have a relationship with, and being introduced with a third party endorsement.

[00:25:18] Chaz Horn: So that’s powerful. Strategic collaborations are very, that’s a different type of strategy. 

[00:25:22] Kris Ward: And I know we’re talking about bigger, bigger numbers and it was an audience you already had, but all these things too can be done through people you meet through a podcast or through LinkedIn.

[00:25:32] Kris Ward: It’s all very doable even in the smallest scale. So I think you bring up some really good points. 

[00:25:37] Chaz Horn: Yeah. It, and I know your audience is what, one to three, typically people on their team, one to five, something like that. Possibly. 

[00:25:44] Kris Ward: Yeah. Yeah. 

[00:25:45] Chaz Horn: Yeah. Just think. If what is it? Vistage. Okay. I know many people who have a team of one to three, one to four, Julie, one of my friend, entrepreneurial friends.

[00:25:56] Chaz Horn: We always discuss tactics and techniques and [00:26:00] strategies. So she goes to Vistage. They don’t pay her very much 500 to a thousand, but because she’s being introduced to Vistage. As a third party endorsement, every time she speaks, usually picks up anywhere from 15 to 25, 000 in new sales because she’s leveraging with a strategy, with a third party endorsement because of a strategic collaboration.

[00:26:26] Kris Ward: Gotcha. That makes sense. Okay. Oh my gosh. The time just flew by there, Chaz. Where can people find more of your brilliance? 

[00:26:35] Chaz Horn: Thank you for that. I appreciate that. And I’ve enjoyed the conversation. If you want to connect with me on LinkedIn, that’s probably the easiest way to search on LinkedIn, Chaz Horn, and you can find me.

[00:26:47] Chaz Horn: That would be the best way. Or you could just email me, just take Chaz Horn at chazhorn. com. No underscore, no dot space, nothing fancy, just Chaz Horn. Yeah. Chaz Horn at chazhorn. [00:27:00] com. It just put Kris. in the subject line, so I know how you found me, I’d be happy to have a conversation with you. 

[00:27:07] Kris Ward: Fantastic. Oh my gosh.

[00:27:08] Kris Ward: Okay. Time well spent. Thank you again, Chaz and everyone else. We look forward to see you in the next show. Thank you. 

[00:27:16] Chaz Horn: Thank you.